Liberty Steel boss: Plants won't shut on my watch
01/04/2021 | news | business | 607
Metal tycoon Sanjeev Gupta is racing to refinance his business after his financial backer collapsed.
1
01/04/2021 09:40:08 6 2
bbc
"The gang shuts down liberty steel"
2
01/04/2021 09:40:34 20 6
bbc
April Fool!
Looking for the April Fool joke on the BBC this morning.

Is it this, or is it Queen Nicola claiming SNP is not divided?
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This must be the april fools joke As i'm pretty sure sturgeon is a joke everyday Removed
Removed
4
01/04/2021 09:41:38 87 6
bbc
In an increasingly unstable world, uk based steal production is a must.
7
01/04/2021 09:44:20 116 9
bbc
An educated workforce would be a start.
11
01/04/2021 09:47:21 12 3
bbc
"Steal" is this some clever play on words?
103
01/04/2021 10:41:21 2 2
bbc
Typo or something more sinister?
380
xlr
01/04/2021 12:07:24 4 1
bbc
All the people with the experience are busy retiring.
383
01/04/2021 12:08:25 0 0
bbc
I like your comment. No doubt you mean that those who STEAL must be protected.
5
01/04/2021 09:42:23 11 7
bbc
You would say that if you were struggling to refinance your own business...

Nationalisation won't be a bad thing - the recent Suez canal blockage, the EU "we're keeping the vaccines" issue... if Brexit is to work, we need to keep a good grip of what little manufacturing is left in the UK.
6
01/04/2021 09:43:21 19 7
bbc
The UK government should buy these steel plants. They are wasting countless £ Billions on some unnecessary Covid-19 items instead of strategic investment in steel, energy, food and other essentials.
38
01/04/2021 09:53:57 15 3
bbc
Nationalisation? Absolutely
465
01/04/2021 13:29:38 1 1
bbc
Nationalisation never works. It creates too much slack.
537
01/04/2021 17:04:02 1 1
bbc
Those were crucial bungs. Not 'waste'.
4
01/04/2021 09:41:38 87 6
bbc
In an increasingly unstable world, uk based steal production is a must.
7
01/04/2021 09:44:20 116 9
bbc
An educated workforce would be a start.
41
01/04/2021 10:03:44 9 4
bbc
Agreed.

But higher or further education has now been made into an expensive commodity that is unaffordable for many.
285
01/04/2021 11:36:54 11 3
bbc
Trouble is we have an excess of supposedly educated 'media studies' type graduates and none ready to work for a living actually doing real work at making things, or no education veg picking jobs. Our excessive benefits security blanket and excessive pay and soft conditions has created generations of soft relaxed entitled wages takers for turning up. Unlike poor countries.
369
01/04/2021 11:44:35 1 3
bbc
Today's workforce IS far better educated than in the past.
The BBC even ran an article in the past week or so which highlighted this.
558
01/04/2021 18:01:38 0 0
bbc
How are public schools working out for Britain?
8
MVP
01/04/2021 09:45:05 30 6
bbc
It is essential for the UK economy that the steel industry continues to operate. It is unthinkable that the government would allow it to fail.
23
01/04/2021 09:54:13 21 5
bbc
And yet, they're thinking about it. Chiefly thinking whose constituencies will be affected.
37
01/04/2021 09:53:27 4 1
bbc
Agreed in a time of crisis Britain must be able to manufacture it's own steel
461
01/04/2021 13:28:00 0 1
bbc
It SHOULD be, but British Steel is no longer viable due to too high costs
9
01/04/2021 09:46:00 76 8
bbc
His reassurances carry about as much weight as a PM saying he has full confidence in his MPs.
36
01/04/2021 09:52:46 28 2
bbc
Agreed but this man will want MPs in Britain to lobby the PM for emergency funding for his failing steel "empire"
10
01/04/2021 09:47:05 154 29
bbc
Now we have left the EU it should be stipulated that British produced steel should be used in all government contracts wherever suitable. It tends to be a better quality product with a longer lifespan than the cheaper more inferior steel from China.
There are a lot of rules we could enforcement to protect people, industry and jobs but for some reason it doesn't seem to happen.

I think probably due to lobbying from various groups with self interests against the common good.

Although obviously as shown in this case even if you get Cameron in to lobby for you it doesn't always come off...
33
01/04/2021 09:51:42 19 5
bbc
Don't agree that Chinese steel is of an inferior quality and very few people will it IS however much much cheaper as it is heavily subsidised by the Chinese government which is committed to ruining the economies of other nations and rivals the HK situation surely suggests the west rethinks it's dealings with China over to you, Johnson
118
01/04/2021 10:44:42 16 9
bbc
British better than Chinese steel? You made me laugh! Even our submarines are not using British steel due to poor quality.
156
01/04/2021 10:59:12 5 0
bbc
'wherever suitable', meaning . . . open to interpretation. Money talks, so if you find a cheaper alternative you'll most likely source from there.
218
01/04/2021 11:17:21 8 11
bbc
If we have a British steel industry to avoid reliance on other "hostile" nations we also need a source of good quality coal from equally friendly nations or from here in the UK. You also have to ignore the naive moaning of silly little climate activists who forget you still have to manufacture things to survive. Otherwise, reliance on China will come at a very heavy price for future generations.
233
01/04/2021 11:20:00 4 1
bbc
Exceptionalism is a lie to control the unthinking.
267
01/04/2021 11:03:17 8 3
bbc
This could have been done whilst within the EU. Other countries have had no problem doing it. You are pointing the finger at the wrong stumbling block. Perhaps it might have a lot to do with the Tories always seeking City concessions first. ;)
307
01/04/2021 11:44:29 3 1
bbc
Lol the germans are refitting our tanks. Says everything about this government and the rubbish deal it signed in December. Brexit is profit for a few while the majority suffer. The hard working population were and will be better off in the single market.
407
01/04/2021 12:37:45 0 1
bbc
Yeah, coz only the EU have trade rules that restrict our ability to do exactly what you said. LMHO
Stipulated is a nice word though. Well done.
429
01/04/2021 12:48:17 2 1
bbc
The number of metallurgy experts we have on here today is staggering! Welcome all of you. Thanks for your years of study to get where you are today!
431
01/04/2021 12:53:11 0 1
bbc
That's an absurd generalisation. All steel is basically the same, apart from a few added trace elements. China can do that the same as any country.
466
YHG
01/04/2021 13:28:19 1 1
bbc
This view might make sense 15 years ago, but not any more.
475
01/04/2021 13:42:13 1 0
bbc
I work for one of the largest construction companies in the UK and a large proportion of our work is public funded. We have to provide detailed information on origins of all steel used (as well as many other materials) and also prove that we are using local labour. What on earth happens with this data though I don't know!?
490
01/04/2021 14:09:25 1 0
bbc
Any tender contract when we were in the EU could have had clauses to support local industry. Both Conservatives and Labour only ever looked at the bottom line.
545
01/04/2021 17:20:56 0 0
bbc
We did not have to leave the EU to do that.
4
01/04/2021 09:41:38 87 6
bbc
In an increasingly unstable world, uk based steal production is a must.
11
01/04/2021 09:47:21 12 3
bbc
"Steal" is this some clever play on words?
15
01/04/2021 09:51:14 11 2
bbc
We have quite enough stealing already, no need to manufacture any more.
12
01/04/2021 09:50:12 8 3
bbc
Plot twist: He resigns from his role tomorrow.
13
01/04/2021 09:50:16 4 1
bbc
... so in reality we're probably looking at the near future then?
Looking for the April Fool joke on the BBC this morning.

Is it this, or is it Queen Nicola claiming SNP is not divided?
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14
stu
bbc
This must be the april fools joke As i'm pretty sure sturgeon is a joke everyday Removed
11
01/04/2021 09:47:21 12 3
bbc
"Steal" is this some clever play on words?
15
01/04/2021 09:51:14 11 2
bbc
We have quite enough stealing already, no need to manufacture any more.
10
01/04/2021 09:47:05 154 29
bbc
Now we have left the EU it should be stipulated that British produced steel should be used in all government contracts wherever suitable. It tends to be a better quality product with a longer lifespan than the cheaper more inferior steel from China.
16
01/04/2021 09:51:20 64 5
bbc
There are a lot of rules we could enforcement to protect people, industry and jobs but for some reason it doesn't seem to happen.

I think probably due to lobbying from various groups with self interests against the common good.

Although obviously as shown in this case even if you get Cameron in to lobby for you it doesn't always come off...
235
01/04/2021 11:20:22 3 1
bbc
Because international trade is more complicated than a simplistic person might think?
Serviously have a think why others might not like protectionist rules whilst we have interests in them not having the same type of protectionist rules?
409
01/04/2021 12:38:45 0 0
bbc
Think harder.
455
01/04/2021 13:18:46 0 1
bbc
"I think probably due to lobbying from various groups with self interests against the common good"

Ah, you are talking about remainers who tried to overturn democracy!
460
01/04/2021 13:27:53 3 0
bbc
It will never happen while the Tory's are in power, it is not in their Political make up to help manufacturing.
Now if Liberty Steels was a Bank, Insurance firm or a hedge fund they would be throwing cash at it.
Liberty asked for £170m, refused, yet the government found £37 BILLION to waste on a test and trace system that was not fit for purpose.
17
01/04/2021 09:52:18 112 23
bbc
Another billionaire pleading poverty, wanting the govt to use taxpayers money to bail his company out.

Give the magic money tree another shake - if we can spend £37bn on failed test & trace, 3x that on HS2, £2.6m on Johnson's office refurb and still bung a few pennies to essential NHS workers then surely we can put our children in more debt to help a billionaire!?
47
01/04/2021 10:09:06 47 91
bbc
Hard to see steel being profitable in the UK anymore.

Brexit has irreparably damaged our market access to Europe and the woke environmentalists protesting against domestic coal extraction means industries like steel are fast becoming obsolete in the UK.
143
01/04/2021 10:53:59 9 5
bbc
But HS2 is a glib arguement as it increases capacity for freight and branch lines, faster journeys being the by-product, and creates 10,000+ jobs and the resultant spend and taxes.
Capital projects are good for the economy. Note, Swansea tidal lagoon should have gone ahead, in a part of the country that deserves investment (I'm not Welsh).
474
01/04/2021 13:40:17 0 2
bbc
The "bail out" as is called would be in the form of a repayable loan/bond issue . If it is nationalized, loss making or not the tax payer pays . A repayable loan would be the cheaper option , after all I think we have enough now to deal with and pay for .
481
01/04/2021 13:46:33 1 0
bbc
But he has, as he said on TV this mornig, sold many homes to just leave him with his £42m house in England. What more could we ask?
18
01/04/2021 09:52:32 6 3
bbc
He'll resign the evening before they shut.
19
01/04/2021 09:52:36 4 2
bbc
An exceptionally well run company, Tata, couldn't make them work. How can Liberty Steel without massive pay-outs like they apparently got from the SNP in Scotland?
20
01/04/2021 09:53:04 0 12
bbc
What they need to do is make things people buy. Instead of making silly steel rods nobody buys.
29
01/04/2021 09:58:28 10 2
bbc
You do realise they sell to businesses, who do use steel rods, not the public?

Thought not...
31
01/04/2021 09:59:11 5 1
bbc
These “silly” steel rods are what people make things from
130
01/04/2021 10:48:39 1 0
bbc
I know, imagine what fool thought that making steel would sell? How they kept doing it for all these years is a mystery.
21
01/04/2021 09:53:34 1 2
bbc
Future of Business and Work means that fixed costs and those include people need to be moved to a variable cost and ideally as a % of revenue. Put those into place then we no longer have issues of losing money. Shared Workforce’s and infrastructure enables this.
22
jon
01/04/2021 09:53:56 82 19
bbc
Support via full nationalisation please. Gupta’s group of companies is so opaque that any other option would be pouring money into a great hole.
39
01/04/2021 09:57:57 32 18
bbc
yes and with Gupta asserting he "started" his own British steel plants he is sort of asserting he started BRITISH STEEL he did not! Nationalisation is THE answer for this industry Be advised though that Gupta will want top dollar to surrender his companies if he can't get more taxpayers' cash it will be one or the other as the industry MUST be saved
136
01/04/2021 10:51:24 2 7
bbc
Are you insane? What is "pouring money into a great hole" is your "full nationalisation".
456
01/04/2021 13:23:25 2 1
bbc
There's no money to support an industry that will eventually collapse due to too high costs
8
MVP
01/04/2021 09:45:05 30 6
bbc
It is essential for the UK economy that the steel industry continues to operate. It is unthinkable that the government would allow it to fail.
23
01/04/2021 09:54:13 21 5
bbc
And yet, they're thinking about it. Chiefly thinking whose constituencies will be affected.
24
PJB
01/04/2021 09:55:29 9 4
bbc
As someone was involved in steel and engineering all my working life I say good luck to Sanjeev Gupta.

It is strategically essential for any major economy to have a viable steel industry, post industrial or not.

And I say to Boris Johnson is this not a great chance to fulfil your seemingly forgotten electoral promises to the "Red Wall"
42
01/04/2021 10:04:31 9 3
bbc
It does depend on the deal the UK Government make, if at all.

The ideology of the Tories is no public ownership. That includes monopolies where the UK people are forced to pay corporations - water companies.

If the business is not viable, then why should we, the tax payer support it for private profit ?

Why should the UK tax payer pay for it just to keep the Tories in power (Red wall) ?
73
01/04/2021 10:02:02 4 1
bbc
NO NO NO don't throw good money after bad! Get this failing industry back into the hands of the British people for our own good
25
01/04/2021 09:55:41 241 53
bbc
This shows the folly of leaving vital industries in the private sector, particularly foreign companies. The mantra that the private sector is more efficient and stands on its own two feet is demonstrably false. When they make profits they kept it to themselves but invariably have their hands out when they makes loses. The railways is a classic example of private greed and inefficiency
40
01/04/2021 10:00:41 95 22
bbc
Bang on the money, matey!!!
86
01/04/2021 10:35:17 22 26
bbc
You were clearly never around in the days of British Rail. It was appalling.
121
01/04/2021 10:45:04 9 3
bbc
It is demonstrably true that the forms of privatisation we have introduced in many cases have not been in the public's or the industries' best interests but nationalised industries were often an ongoing disaster too. A new form of 'private' industry with multiple protections from asset stripping could be an answer.
133
01/04/2021 10:49:16 19 6
bbc
I agree. I think it is time to nationalise some key industries but they need to be efficiently run unlike before.
Rail had 30 to 40 years of under investment before the private sector took over.
134
01/04/2021 10:49:58 10 27
bbc
Contrary to grandma's bedtime stories, publicly run companies don't look after "the people" but after the bureaucrats who run them.

And unlike their private counterparts, they don't worry for loses.

You're fortunate enough to live in country where you don't have experience of public ownership, but the world is full of examples of incompetence, cronyism and corruption.
140
01/04/2021 10:52:07 6 16
bbc
So much better for the tax payer to subsidise a loss making service like BR to the tune of billions every year when most of us can't even get near a train without using a car!

Paid for by the many for the privileged few to use.
149
01/04/2021 10:57:12 8 15
bbc
With regard to the railways, I understand your point of view, but those of us who can remember British Rail will tell you that simple nationalisation of key assets is not the answer.
154
01/04/2021 10:43:09 3 7
bbc
These plants were not viable under state ownership and have not been viable under numerous private owners. Bringing the back under state ownership will just be like applying a bandaid.
169
01/04/2021 11:03:43 9 1
bbc
It's worse than that. This is about incompetence and FRUAD.

Want to know what I am talking about? Ask Dave.
182
01/04/2021 11:07:12 8 1
bbc
That's how you get rich, gamble with other money and pay no tax. Business is nothing as greed and corruption on the bigger level.
190
01/04/2021 11:08:30 3 13
bbc
One example, anywhere in the world, ever, of the state running any enterprise efficiently?

I cannot think of a single one.

Everything the state touches is an inefficient shambles be it local authority, NHS or more specifically any state run utility.

It's like the last 100 years of lessons/history literally never happened for some of you!
208
01/04/2021 11:15:08 0 6
bbc
The foreign ownership is totally irrelevant, otherwise, yeah.
264
01/04/2021 11:14:05 1 8
bbc
Nonsense!
The private sector does indeed stand, or fail, on its own two feet & steel manufacturing is most assuredly NOT the task of government.
I can remember the days of British Rail & believe me, they were the epitome of inefficiency, atrocious service & dire management, as was British Steel itself.
315
01/04/2021 11:48:15 1 8
bbc
It's an inconvenient truth that nationalisation was a disaster for the railway last time around: the Beeching review would have been impossible before nationalisation. Be very careful what you wish for!
321
01/04/2021 11:50:18 1 2
bbc
I agree with your sentiments, however, "private sector is more efficient and stands on its own two feet is demonstrably false" is not false, this is how neo-liberalism works, governments gave industry and finance power to do as they please re big profits at the expense of anything else, new capitalism works like this, it's a global economy but not a global community!
361
01/04/2021 12:01:06 0 2
bbc
What a load of complete tosh. It is the complete lack of interest in a joined up Industrial Strategy form both Labour and Conservative Governments that has put is in the predicament. Gordon Brown selling North Sea Oil at $10 a barrel like it was going out of fashion to pay for public services in his post industrial society. Not as simple as nationalism which frankly didn’t work in UK
371
01/04/2021 11:48:34 0 6
bbc
Still... better to request the occasional bail-out than constantly having the begging bowl on the doorstep like the NHS.

Give them gruel one week and they demand fillet steak the next, with a side of Condor eggs.
378
01/04/2021 11:54:43 0 6
bbc
The railways are a publicly owned entity. National Rail isn’t a private company. And as others have said pre-privatisation of the train routes was absolutely appalling. But at least it didn’t cost as much eh? British Rail was an utter shambles.

Private companies are much more efficient than public ones as they have shareholders to answer to. The NHS being the prime example vs private health.
26
01/04/2021 09:55:59 52 3
bbc
So GFG owe Greensill £5bn, and Liberty Steel require £170m.

So what is happening with the businesses of Mr Gupta ?.

Will any bailout just disappear ?, similar to the MG Rover scandal ?
408
01/04/2021 12:38:25 13 0
bbc
The GFG empire is little more than a Ponzi scheme, with whatever funds it can raise just being used to pay off earlier creditors. The only surprising thing is that it's managed to stagger along for as long as it has.
27
01/04/2021 09:39:18 4 2
bbc
Has he got Denise Coates' phone number?
28
01/04/2021 09:41:35 60 6
bbc
“Plants won't shut on my watch“

That’s your guarantee that they are in fact doomed
457
01/04/2021 13:24:27 4 3
bbc
That's like saying "British Steel is viable"
20
01/04/2021 09:53:04 0 12
bbc
What they need to do is make things people buy. Instead of making silly steel rods nobody buys.
29
01/04/2021 09:58:28 10 2
bbc
You do realise they sell to businesses, who do use steel rods, not the public?

Thought not...
30
01/04/2021 09:58:52 62 19
bbc
It's easy, Sanjeev - just become a Tory party donor, they'll give you billions for any old thing then.
172
01/04/2021 11:04:10 26 47
bbc
Labour have no business donors because they do not understand business.
386
01/04/2021 12:10:29 7 0
bbc
Lord Gupta anyone?
20
01/04/2021 09:53:04 0 12
bbc
What they need to do is make things people buy. Instead of making silly steel rods nobody buys.
31
01/04/2021 09:59:11 5 1
bbc
These “silly” steel rods are what people make things from
Looking for the April Fool joke on the BBC this morning.

Is it this, or is it Queen Nicola claiming SNP is not divided?
Removed
Removed
10
01/04/2021 09:47:05 154 29
bbc
Now we have left the EU it should be stipulated that British produced steel should be used in all government contracts wherever suitable. It tends to be a better quality product with a longer lifespan than the cheaper more inferior steel from China.
33
01/04/2021 09:51:42 19 5
bbc
Don't agree that Chinese steel is of an inferior quality and very few people will it IS however much much cheaper as it is heavily subsidised by the Chinese government which is committed to ruining the economies of other nations and rivals the HK situation surely suggests the west rethinks it's dealings with China over to you, Johnson
125
01/04/2021 10:46:50 1 5
bbc
Could use a few comas in there!
34
01/04/2021 10:01:28 4 2
bbc
I'm not really sure how someone in the commercial sector can make a promise like this. Unfortunately there are lots of examples of such pledges not lasting. If its strategically important it should be managed as a national asset
53
01/04/2021 10:12:52 5 0
bbc
I always find it a red flag when they say such things, it's a bit like when a football chairman publicly states the managers job is safe...
35
01/04/2021 10:02:38 41 14
bbc
Essential things like transport, finances/ banking, water, electricity/ gas/ oil = energy , health care, internet and yes.....steel industry should never be in private hands. Private is for a profit. You cannot and should not make profit on essentials. It is immoral. Nationalise the whole thing.
45
01/04/2021 10:07:32 14 17
bbc
Does that extend to pharmaceuticals? It could get very expensive, you’ll vote for the necessary increase in taxes?
54
01/04/2021 10:12:53 10 12
bbc
And just how do you suggest we pay for this wish list?

Given that our National Debt is already at record levels you want to bung a whole load more on top. Sheer genius.
131
01/04/2021 10:48:41 9 9
bbc
This is the UK not the USSR. We have seen Socialism just never works (apart from the post war era when there was no choice) and have rejected socialist policies in the last 3 GEs. And now you want Communism here?
Well good luck with selling that turd....

Much as we all appreciate and admire the NHS for what it does no one can suggest it is anything other than the usual nationalised money pit.
185
01/04/2021 11:07:37 0 2
bbc
Yes, bring back British Rail.
502
01/04/2021 14:46:40 0 3
bbc
All these industries should be allowed to.make profits. Nationalisation should not be permitted.
9
01/04/2021 09:46:00 76 8
bbc
His reassurances carry about as much weight as a PM saying he has full confidence in his MPs.
36
01/04/2021 09:52:46 28 2
bbc
Agreed but this man will want MPs in Britain to lobby the PM for emergency funding for his failing steel "empire"
296
01/04/2021 11:41:34 2 2
bbc
Yeah but remember his "empire" employs many thousands of workers who pay tax and generate income. Put them out of work and they can only receive welfare payments, guess who pays that.
8
MVP
01/04/2021 09:45:05 30 6
bbc
It is essential for the UK economy that the steel industry continues to operate. It is unthinkable that the government would allow it to fail.
37
01/04/2021 09:53:27 4 1
bbc
Agreed in a time of crisis Britain must be able to manufacture it's own steel
6
01/04/2021 09:43:21 19 7
bbc
The UK government should buy these steel plants. They are wasting countless £ Billions on some unnecessary Covid-19 items instead of strategic investment in steel, energy, food and other essentials.
38
01/04/2021 09:53:57 15 3
bbc
Nationalisation? Absolutely
22
jon
01/04/2021 09:53:56 82 19
bbc
Support via full nationalisation please. Gupta’s group of companies is so opaque that any other option would be pouring money into a great hole.
39
01/04/2021 09:57:57 32 18
bbc
yes and with Gupta asserting he "started" his own British steel plants he is sort of asserting he started BRITISH STEEL he did not! Nationalisation is THE answer for this industry Be advised though that Gupta will want top dollar to surrender his companies if he can't get more taxpayers' cash it will be one or the other as the industry MUST be saved
90
01/04/2021 10:36:51 6 7
bbc
Why must an inefficient industry be saved?
165
01/04/2021 11:02:12 6 8
bbc
We need to help out the steel industry but simple nationalisation does not work. Remember British Rail?
211
01/04/2021 11:15:52 2 6
bbc
No, we should be putting this money toward developing steel substitutes like carbon to reduce CO2 output and not wallow in 19th century industries.
25
01/04/2021 09:55:41 241 53
bbc
This shows the folly of leaving vital industries in the private sector, particularly foreign companies. The mantra that the private sector is more efficient and stands on its own two feet is demonstrably false. When they make profits they kept it to themselves but invariably have their hands out when they makes loses. The railways is a classic example of private greed and inefficiency
40
01/04/2021 10:00:41 95 22
bbc
Bang on the money, matey!!!
7
01/04/2021 09:44:20 116 9
bbc
An educated workforce would be a start.
41
01/04/2021 10:03:44 9 4
bbc
Agreed.

But higher or further education has now been made into an expensive commodity that is unaffordable for many.
230
01/04/2021 10:57:06 5 4
bbc
And yet more young British people than EVER before are going to university.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/university-students-young-people-over-half-first-time-a9122321.html

Not sure how anyone can convince themselves the workforce is less educated than at any time in the past.
452
01/04/2021 13:14:19 0 1
bbc
Utter drivel in the past so many people went to university rather than stand on their own two feet and one degree on top of another then doing nothing that they were meant for.

Ignorance is saying higher education is unaffordable for if you swot up on the subject you only pay back when earnings allow it, this will make many think twice about squandering tax payers money on pointless subjects
504
01/04/2021 14:49:31 1 0
bbc
And the quality greatly reduced too, a degree in most cases is now worthless despite the high cost of gaining it.
24
PJB
01/04/2021 09:55:29 9 4
bbc
As someone was involved in steel and engineering all my working life I say good luck to Sanjeev Gupta.

It is strategically essential for any major economy to have a viable steel industry, post industrial or not.

And I say to Boris Johnson is this not a great chance to fulfil your seemingly forgotten electoral promises to the "Red Wall"
42
01/04/2021 10:04:31 9 3
bbc
It does depend on the deal the UK Government make, if at all.

The ideology of the Tories is no public ownership. That includes monopolies where the UK people are forced to pay corporations - water companies.

If the business is not viable, then why should we, the tax payer support it for private profit ?

Why should the UK tax payer pay for it just to keep the Tories in power (Red wall) ?
55
PJB
01/04/2021 10:14:03 2 2
bbc
Your post makes the incorrect assumption that our competitors play by the rules on subsidies. EU countries in particular use all sorts of ruses to implement invisible support to eg. the French energy industry.
43
01/04/2021 10:06:37 3 3
bbc
"On his watch" is code for probably will..
44
RRP
01/04/2021 10:07:10 5 5
bbc
Good luck Mr Gupta. I hope you succeed.
35
01/04/2021 10:02:38 41 14
bbc
Essential things like transport, finances/ banking, water, electricity/ gas/ oil = energy , health care, internet and yes.....steel industry should never be in private hands. Private is for a profit. You cannot and should not make profit on essentials. It is immoral. Nationalise the whole thing.
45
01/04/2021 10:07:32 14 17
bbc
Does that extend to pharmaceuticals? It could get very expensive, you’ll vote for the necessary increase in taxes?
49
01/04/2021 10:09:44 8 4
bbc
Pharma has one of the biggest profit margins of any businesses, other than banking.
46
01/04/2021 10:08:56 7 3
bbc
The main problem with the 'UK' or 'British' steel industry is......it's not the 'UK' or 'British' steel industry.
52
01/04/2021 10:11:52 5 5
bbc
But it could and should be, if it really is important. If it's not, let it go bust like any other failing business.
17
01/04/2021 09:52:18 112 23
bbc
Another billionaire pleading poverty, wanting the govt to use taxpayers money to bail his company out.

Give the magic money tree another shake - if we can spend £37bn on failed test & trace, 3x that on HS2, £2.6m on Johnson's office refurb and still bung a few pennies to essential NHS workers then surely we can put our children in more debt to help a billionaire!?
47
01/04/2021 10:09:06 47 91
bbc
Hard to see steel being profitable in the UK anymore.

Brexit has irreparably damaged our market access to Europe and the woke environmentalists protesting against domestic coal extraction means industries like steel are fast becoming obsolete in the UK.
82
b
01/04/2021 10:32:17 12 7
bbc
What's the difference between an environmentalist and a woke environmentalist?
132
01/04/2021 10:49:14 15 14
bbc
When was the steel industry last profitable long term in the UK? Brexit has a small part to play & its effects are still to be fully felt but if there are cheap imports from Asia, even with transport costs added, then this is the problem. Unless we get rid of half the so called employee rights & cut the minimum wage we have no chance of competing.
146
01/04/2021 10:55:51 3 6
bbc
Can you explain how it has damaged EU market access? considering there is no automatic Tariffs as first feared.
Another remainer winging on you lost so it is time to get the chip of your shoulder. We have already proved with the vaccine roll out that we are better off without the pigs at the trough in the E.U Removed
160
01/04/2021 11:00:35 4 8
bbc
How much UK-made steel was exported to EU countries? The problems of the UK steel industry predate Brexit by decades.
175
01/04/2021 11:05:25 5 1
bbc
Very true. energy costs in the UK are crippling heavy industry
199
01/04/2021 10:48:03 4 4
bbc
These plants were loss makers before Brexit. Liberty were never going to be able to make the work.
243
01/04/2021 11:23:11 4 1
bbc
A significant amount of our steel production is already produced by electricity and not coal! It’s already much cleaner to use British manufactured steel than it is Chinese steel!!!
258
01/04/2021 11:27:54 5 2
bbc
Attacking Brexit AND woke environmentalists? This is going to bamboozle the flag copulaters!
263
TV
01/04/2021 11:30:16 0 3
bbc
I think the UK is obsolete, lol
324
01/04/2021 11:31:01 1 5
bbc
Sheer Remainer nonsense.
The reason steel making isn't profitable in the UK affects Europe too.
It's China.
Their steel industry isn't hamstrung by concerns of environmental pollution or high energy costs & it's China's strategic aim to destroy steel making capacity elsewhere.
482
01/04/2021 13:51:04 1 0
bbc
There has been a huge resurgence in the steel market in the Uk and Europe courtesy of Coronavirus .. impossible for the steel companies not to be making a killing at the moment as some steel grades have doubled in price int eh space of 3 months.
579
01/04/2021 20:31:05 0 1
bbc
Most of that coal, 85% destined for EU ????

Thatcher destroyed British heavy industry a long time ago, a bit late to be shedding false tears about it now.
48
01/04/2021 10:09:33 6 4
bbc
Thank you for supporting British manufacturing, we need more self sufficiency as a country, as can be seen in recent events and as history has proved you can't always on production from elsewhere.
45
01/04/2021 10:07:32 14 17
bbc
Does that extend to pharmaceuticals? It could get very expensive, you’ll vote for the necessary increase in taxes?
49
01/04/2021 10:09:44 8 4
bbc
Pharma has one of the biggest profit margins of any businesses, other than banking.
50
01/04/2021 10:11:06 0 9
bbc
Seems like a win win. Either the business succeeds and costs the taxpayer nothing, or it fails, the Government buys it for £1, and we have a publicly owned steel business again.
68
01/04/2021 10:24:29 6 2
bbc
Buys the assets for a pound but still has to deal with the liabilities - many billions.
104
01/04/2021 10:41:34 0 0
bbc
Not sure where a "publicly owned steel business" is a 'win'. The other privately owned steel businesses might have something to say about that. The USA would undoubtedly raise penal tariffs above where they are already thanks to earlier EU policies.
Of course we can and should offer creative State Aid but it must not be to one business and must assist the whole industry.
51
01/04/2021 10:11:25 50 11
bbc
It's about time core industries and utilities were nationalised. It's funny how much it turns out we can subsidise when we actually want to. If you want to level up the North, give it back some of the industries it was/is immensely proud of. You pay a bit more for steel but get revitalised communities.
60
01/04/2021 10:19:51 52 4
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
67
01/04/2021 10:23:40 1 0
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
87
01/04/2021 10:36:15 6 12
bbc
'Nationalised industries' sounds good but they failed this country in the '50s, '60s and into the '70s. Over manned, management crippled by militant unions, strikes like a national sport and lack of investment created high prices and low productivity while private steel makers in Germany, USA and Japan leapt ahead of us.
Steelworks vs NHS - Guess which gets funded?
Socialism has never worked
370
01/04/2021 11:47:46 1 5
bbc
I remember the ongoing disaster, inefficiency & dire service delivered by the nationalised industries, along with the massive subsidies they needed in order to survive.
It's a totally insane way to run things.
46
01/04/2021 10:08:56 7 3
bbc
The main problem with the 'UK' or 'British' steel industry is......it's not the 'UK' or 'British' steel industry.
52
01/04/2021 10:11:52 5 5
bbc
But it could and should be, if it really is important. If it's not, let it go bust like any other failing business.
34
01/04/2021 10:01:28 4 2
bbc
I'm not really sure how someone in the commercial sector can make a promise like this. Unfortunately there are lots of examples of such pledges not lasting. If its strategically important it should be managed as a national asset
53
01/04/2021 10:12:52 5 0
bbc
I always find it a red flag when they say such things, it's a bit like when a football chairman publicly states the managers job is safe...
35
01/04/2021 10:02:38 41 14
bbc
Essential things like transport, finances/ banking, water, electricity/ gas/ oil = energy , health care, internet and yes.....steel industry should never be in private hands. Private is for a profit. You cannot and should not make profit on essentials. It is immoral. Nationalise the whole thing.
54
01/04/2021 10:12:53 10 12
bbc
And just how do you suggest we pay for this wish list?

Given that our National Debt is already at record levels you want to bung a whole load more on top. Sheer genius.
124
01/04/2021 10:46:34 7 3
bbc
The same way other economies do, and the same way the UK did from 2008 onwards.

QE, bonds, gilts, investing and taxing - a virtuous cycle.

National Debt is never due, it's a pretend debt and the pretence is always used to reduce council funding, benefits, the NHS, etc.. yet when Lloyds Of London needs a bung, that's conveniently not an issue after all.
42
01/04/2021 10:04:31 9 3
bbc
It does depend on the deal the UK Government make, if at all.

The ideology of the Tories is no public ownership. That includes monopolies where the UK people are forced to pay corporations - water companies.

If the business is not viable, then why should we, the tax payer support it for private profit ?

Why should the UK tax payer pay for it just to keep the Tories in power (Red wall) ?
55
PJB
01/04/2021 10:14:03 2 2
bbc
Your post makes the incorrect assumption that our competitors play by the rules on subsidies. EU countries in particular use all sorts of ruses to implement invisible support to eg. the French energy industry.
158
01/04/2021 10:59:13 2 1
bbc
Please can you provide evidence where Germany or France do not play by the rules.

Please see :
https://fullfact.org/economy/ask-full-fact-british-steel-and-eu-rules/

If energy is cheaper in other countries, then perhaps they have invested in their infrastructure. Recall that the Tories were contracting the Chinese to build a nuclear power station whose cost per kWh was 2x more than others.
56
01/04/2021 10:14:56 7 2
bbc
Before we buy it for a £1 - look up the associated 'Debt' the company has built up. The corporations load up the companies with debt to finance something else then leave the original company to sink or swim.
57
01/04/2021 10:16:21 28 2
bbc
The fallout from Greenshill is going to snowball and this is just the beginning.

Politicians were complicit in Greenshill's huge overleaveraging and now the chickens are beginning to come home to roost.

Have no doubt, there are a lot of chickens.
58
jez
01/04/2021 10:17:40 2 2
bbc
Yes I’m sure they won’t close
59
01/04/2021 10:18:39 5 5
bbc
You can tell by his body language he knew his business is not good

Well, when you have ta ta you get ta ta

end of
51
01/04/2021 10:11:25 50 11
bbc
It's about time core industries and utilities were nationalised. It's funny how much it turns out we can subsidise when we actually want to. If you want to level up the North, give it back some of the industries it was/is immensely proud of. You pay a bit more for steel but get revitalised communities.
60
01/04/2021 10:19:51 52 4
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
66
01/04/2021 10:23:27 0 0
bbc
Sorry replied to wrong comment.
61
01/04/2021 10:21:51 5 3
bbc
That's the sort of thing a politician says, and usually means the opposite.
I.e. it's a big fat lie.
62
01/04/2021 10:21:54 10 8
bbc
It's a shame for Gupta in a way, he has tried to genuinely modernise the British holdings with a lot of investment he said Brexit and Covid were a double whammy for Liberty. (I'm not making a brexit point)
69
01/04/2021 10:24:31 11 1
bbc
You've suggested post brexit Britain isn't the land of milk, honey, unicorns and flags. Prepare for frothy retribution.
72
01/04/2021 10:26:24 7 1
bbc
I thin the problem is Gupta's dealings in other areas of his investment empire have been somewhat opaque.
63
01/04/2021 10:22:40 5 3
bbc
So, plants will shut then
64
01/04/2021 10:22:57 22 3
bbc
The Govt refused to step in to save 12,000 jobs when Debenhams went under. This time there are greater political considerations for the Conservative Party in allowing a steel company to close where 5000 jobs are at risk. See also Tata Steel and British Steel.
106
01/04/2021 10:42:27 26 2
bbc
Debenhams isn't a core strategic industry
167
01/04/2021 11:03:09 3 0
bbc
Sheffield Council did step in to save John Lewis by buying the leasehold and putting up the money for a refurbishment. It’s right next to an area of smart new redevelopment and should do well out of it. But that was not enough - John Lewis is closing in Sheffield with the loss of 300 jobs.
Several more hundreds of Liberty Steel jobs now at risk in Stocksbridge (Sheffield) and nearby Rotherham.
65
01/04/2021 10:23:08 22 3
bbc
Did Gupta buy loss making steel plants out of kindness or because he could leverage the assets to borrow more money. But eventually the primary lender realised they were not going to get their money back.
Now by trying to keep them open Gupta struggles to avoid a fire sale.
If we nationalise these plants it should be along side securing UK coking coal and steel requiring North sea oil platforms.
99
01/04/2021 10:40:06 12 2
bbc
But haven't the goverment beed attacked for wanting to open a new mine for just that purpose?
60
01/04/2021 10:19:51 52 4
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
66
01/04/2021 10:23:27 0 0
bbc
Sorry replied to wrong comment.
51
01/04/2021 10:11:25 50 11
bbc
It's about time core industries and utilities were nationalised. It's funny how much it turns out we can subsidise when we actually want to. If you want to level up the North, give it back some of the industries it was/is immensely proud of. You pay a bit more for steel but get revitalised communities.
67
01/04/2021 10:23:40 1 0
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
71
01/04/2021 10:26:18 5 0
bbc
Done it again!
50
01/04/2021 10:11:06 0 9
bbc
Seems like a win win. Either the business succeeds and costs the taxpayer nothing, or it fails, the Government buys it for £1, and we have a publicly owned steel business again.
68
01/04/2021 10:24:29 6 2
bbc
Buys the assets for a pound but still has to deal with the liabilities - many billions.
77
01/04/2021 10:29:54 2 0
bbc
How many £billions?
62
01/04/2021 10:21:54 10 8
bbc
It's a shame for Gupta in a way, he has tried to genuinely modernise the British holdings with a lot of investment he said Brexit and Covid were a double whammy for Liberty. (I'm not making a brexit point)
69
01/04/2021 10:24:31 11 1
bbc
You've suggested post brexit Britain isn't the land of milk, honey, unicorns and flags. Prepare for frothy retribution.
70
01/04/2021 10:25:49 2 5
bbc
I'm sure the Chinese will come to the rescue,
75
01/04/2021 10:29:14 6 4
bbc
The Chinese have to find a home for all their cash.
Capital always hunts for ways to expand. It's like a fire searches out fuel.
Meanwhile in the socialist paradise they are opening up gulags every week and there is nothing to be done about it.
81
01/04/2021 10:31:16 1 0
bbc
Na........
67
01/04/2021 10:23:40 1 0
bbc
I think ASDA the supermarket was "bought" using mega mega loans creating huge debt to clear. It's the modern way. Everything is made out of chipboard and canvas like a film set. Nothing has substance in Britain any more.
71
01/04/2021 10:26:18 5 0
bbc
Done it again!
62
01/04/2021 10:21:54 10 8
bbc
It's a shame for Gupta in a way, he has tried to genuinely modernise the British holdings with a lot of investment he said Brexit and Covid were a double whammy for Liberty. (I'm not making a brexit point)
72
01/04/2021 10:26:24 7 1
bbc
I thin the problem is Gupta's dealings in other areas of his investment empire have been somewhat opaque.
98
01/04/2021 10:39:45 6 0
bbc
"I thin the problem is Gupta's dealings in other areas of his investment empire have been somewhat opaque."

You mean a kingpin of UK business hasn't been totally open and transparent and might have done some shady things??? Goodness me!
24
PJB
01/04/2021 09:55:29 9 4
bbc
As someone was involved in steel and engineering all my working life I say good luck to Sanjeev Gupta.

It is strategically essential for any major economy to have a viable steel industry, post industrial or not.

And I say to Boris Johnson is this not a great chance to fulfil your seemingly forgotten electoral promises to the "Red Wall"
73
01/04/2021 10:02:02 4 1
bbc
NO NO NO don't throw good money after bad! Get this failing industry back into the hands of the British people for our own good
122
PJB
01/04/2021 10:45:44 1 2
bbc
Where did I say otherwise. My point is that we have to support our steel industry, whether under private or public ownership, as it is a strategic primary necessity.
74
JDW
bbc
Removed
70
01/04/2021 10:25:49 2 5
bbc
I'm sure the Chinese will come to the rescue,
75
01/04/2021 10:29:14 6 4
bbc
The Chinese have to find a home for all their cash.
Capital always hunts for ways to expand. It's like a fire searches out fuel.
Meanwhile in the socialist paradise they are opening up gulags every week and there is nothing to be done about it.
76
01/04/2021 10:29:54 30 3
bbc
He must know something we don’t. Not Call me Dave again. These “independent” investigations can’t keep whitewashing (bluewashing) reality
68
01/04/2021 10:24:29 6 2
bbc
Buys the assets for a pound but still has to deal with the liabilities - many billions.
77
01/04/2021 10:29:54 2 0
bbc
How many £billions?
85
01/04/2021 10:34:07 2 0
bbc
I think it's between 2.6 and 5.6 outstanding. (for the British bits) depends how you measure it or who's lawyer you talk to.

The £170, 000,000 he asked for was to tide him over.
78
01/04/2021 10:29:59 41 9
bbc
There is simply too much sleaze in the corporate world from auditors to opaque financing structures to complicit lobbying to lack of moral responsibility and it infects every sector from retail to construction to banking to industry - until we totally clean our act up it won't go away - and that will not happen within the self interests of the Tory Party
178
01/04/2021 11:06:06 10 31
bbc
Wealth creation, increased jobs and investment will do not happen under a Labour government because they know nothing about business.
79
01/04/2021 10:30:24 52 9
bbc
Gupta is an asset stripper who knew, fine well, Greensill was on the ropes. He thought he could make a quick killing, literally, and then tries to offset his losses with a government hand out. He should be removed from the country and permanently banned from future access.
97
01/04/2021 10:39:32 28 4
bbc
His company have invested quite heavily in upgrading the British works.

It's not like Boots the Chemist owned by an American private equity firm and nosediving. The shops aren't even clean any more. Like the AA, you name it. They are the ones who wring the life out of British companies and take off back to the Caymans.
80
01/04/2021 10:30:50 9 18
bbc
Presumably Sir Keir Hindsight would advocate borrowing billions, renationalising it and then handing it over to the unions to run it into the ground?
83
01/04/2021 10:32:20 6 2
bbc
Sigh...
84
01/04/2021 10:33:15 7 1
bbc
Why would the unions be running it? Isn't that what management is for? Besides, it's already been "run into the ground" so public ownership couldn't be worse than private.
88
01/04/2021 10:36:18 3 4
bbc
That's what he would do because he is stupid and the unions have no vested interest in keeping their jobs and livelihoods
138
01/04/2021 10:51:45 2 1
bbc
While Tories just give money to rich friends to run it into the ground
70
01/04/2021 10:25:49 2 5
bbc
I'm sure the Chinese will come to the rescue,
81
01/04/2021 10:31:16 1 0
bbc
Na........
47
01/04/2021 10:09:06 47 91
bbc
Hard to see steel being profitable in the UK anymore.

Brexit has irreparably damaged our market access to Europe and the woke environmentalists protesting against domestic coal extraction means industries like steel are fast becoming obsolete in the UK.
82
b
01/04/2021 10:32:17 12 7
bbc
What's the difference between an environmentalist and a woke environmentalist?
200
01/04/2021 10:49:09 6 3
bbc
One is environmentally aware and the latter uses the environment and every other woke issue as an excuse to constantly moan & ram it down people's throats... usually whilst hypocritically doing the opposite.
Idiot Removed
251
01/04/2021 11:26:06 4 3
bbc
The first is a serious term. The latter a childish attempt to insult.
80
01/04/2021 10:30:50 9 18
bbc
Presumably Sir Keir Hindsight would advocate borrowing billions, renationalising it and then handing it over to the unions to run it into the ground?
83
01/04/2021 10:32:20 6 2
bbc
Sigh...
80
01/04/2021 10:30:50 9 18
bbc
Presumably Sir Keir Hindsight would advocate borrowing billions, renationalising it and then handing it over to the unions to run it into the ground?
84
01/04/2021 10:33:15 7 1
bbc
Why would the unions be running it? Isn't that what management is for? Besides, it's already been "run into the ground" so public ownership couldn't be worse than private.
109
01/04/2021 10:37:16 1 1
bbc
"Why would the unions be running it? Isn't that what management is for?"

One might own a casino in vegas, but its the Mafia that run it....
77
01/04/2021 10:29:54 2 0
bbc
How many £billions?
85
01/04/2021 10:34:07 2 0
bbc
I think it's between 2.6 and 5.6 outstanding. (for the British bits) depends how you measure it or who's lawyer you talk to.

The £170, 000,000 he asked for was to tide him over.
92
01/04/2021 10:37:44 0 0
bbc
So that's pretty much nothing in the scheme of things.
25
01/04/2021 09:55:41 241 53
bbc
This shows the folly of leaving vital industries in the private sector, particularly foreign companies. The mantra that the private sector is more efficient and stands on its own two feet is demonstrably false. When they make profits they kept it to themselves but invariably have their hands out when they makes loses. The railways is a classic example of private greed and inefficiency
86
01/04/2021 10:35:17 22 26
bbc
You were clearly never around in the days of British Rail. It was appalling.
95
01/04/2021 10:39:16 39 11
bbc
Deliberately underfunded British rail to help sell the privatisation Idea
170
01/04/2021 11:03:43 10 3
bbc
I very much was and though not perfect it was a damn sight better than the current fiasco
220
01/04/2021 11:17:25 9 1
bbc
That is not true. I travelled on BR every day and frequently throughout the UK. They were certainly no worse than post privatisation. You were clearly an early victim of gaslighting.
51
01/04/2021 10:11:25 50 11
bbc
It's about time core industries and utilities were nationalised. It's funny how much it turns out we can subsidise when we actually want to. If you want to level up the North, give it back some of the industries it was/is immensely proud of. You pay a bit more for steel but get revitalised communities.
87
01/04/2021 10:36:15 6 12
bbc
'Nationalised industries' sounds good but they failed this country in the '50s, '60s and into the '70s. Over manned, management crippled by militant unions, strikes like a national sport and lack of investment created high prices and low productivity while private steel makers in Germany, USA and Japan leapt ahead of us.
Steelworks vs NHS - Guess which gets funded?
Socialism has never worked
116
01/04/2021 10:43:58 12 4
bbc
Half truths and disinformation.

Using 1940s tooling for 1970s products was an inevitable disaster. Refusal to invest allowed to rest of the world to leapfrog ahead, and would have solved half the problems the unions faced. Not all, but some.

Socialism has never been tried. Capitalism has never worked for the majority, and only ever for the 1%.
330
01/04/2021 11:51:42 3 1
bbc
Nationalised key strategic industries is not the same as all out socialism. I want nationalised industries but not at the expense of being a socialist country.

It’s wrong to say they are mutually synonymous- a recent survey showed more Tory voters favoured renationalising the trains than labour ones.
80
01/04/2021 10:30:50 9 18
bbc
Presumably Sir Keir Hindsight would advocate borrowing billions, renationalising it and then handing it over to the unions to run it into the ground?
88
01/04/2021 10:36:18 3 4
bbc
That's what he would do because he is stupid and the unions have no vested interest in keeping their jobs and livelihoods
155
01/04/2021 10:43:43 0 1
bbc
no he is not stupid no more tat the industry has to be saved and no more money for this incompetent businessman and the idea that the unions have an interest in the industrial suicide of their members is not intelligent
89
01/04/2021 10:36:41 2 6
bbc
At least good for the UK climate

Shut it
?? Removed
120
01/04/2021 10:44:58 1 0
bbc
And here you are again posting on a UK forum from China! As a competitor for steel, you would say that!!
194
01/04/2021 11:09:05 0 0
bbc
Doesn't really help when China is destroying the world
39
01/04/2021 09:57:57 32 18
bbc
yes and with Gupta asserting he "started" his own British steel plants he is sort of asserting he started BRITISH STEEL he did not! Nationalisation is THE answer for this industry Be advised though that Gupta will want top dollar to surrender his companies if he can't get more taxpayers' cash it will be one or the other as the industry MUST be saved
90
01/04/2021 10:36:51 6 7
bbc
Why must an inefficient industry be saved?
123
01/04/2021 10:46:12 9 1
bbc
Are you really not aware of the strategic importance of a country having it`s own Steel manufacturing capability?
216
01/04/2021 10:50:39 4 1
bbc
Where DO you people come from? Go think about STEEL!!!!
91
01/04/2021 10:37:07 6 4
bbc
Perhaps he should have bet some of his money on Bet365 and Mrs Coates could pass on some of her £469 million ANNUAL salary.
100
01/04/2021 10:40:28 2 1
bbc
Because Mrs Coates is somehow responsible for Mr Gupta's empire? Why not the Sultan of Brunei / some sport palyer / a pop star?
85
01/04/2021 10:34:07 2 0
bbc
I think it's between 2.6 and 5.6 outstanding. (for the British bits) depends how you measure it or who's lawyer you talk to.

The £170, 000,000 he asked for was to tide him over.
92
01/04/2021 10:37:44 0 0
bbc
So that's pretty much nothing in the scheme of things.
93
01/04/2021 10:37:49 5 3
bbc
It's pantomime season already

Oh yes they will

More unemployment coming
89
01/04/2021 10:36:41 2 6
bbc
At least good for the UK climate

Shut it
?? Removed
86
01/04/2021 10:35:17 22 26
bbc
You were clearly never around in the days of British Rail. It was appalling.
95
01/04/2021 10:39:16 39 11
bbc
Deliberately underfunded British rail to help sell the privatisation Idea
114
01/04/2021 10:43:24 18 27
bbc
British Rail was appalling for decades, well before privatisation was dreamt of
365
01/04/2021 12:01:54 3 0
bbc
True and then it was "sold off" to private companies, with profits coming from public money and subsidies. Railtrack shares were very high, until it was decided to cut off some of the taxpayers funds which made it valuable. Shareholders then complained about their shares price dropping.
But many private companies rely on generous government spending & funds. Think generous PPI contracts.
96
01/04/2021 10:39:19 4 3
bbc
"Not on my watch".
Oh dear, my watch appears to have stopped.
79
01/04/2021 10:30:24 52 9
bbc
Gupta is an asset stripper who knew, fine well, Greensill was on the ropes. He thought he could make a quick killing, literally, and then tries to offset his losses with a government hand out. He should be removed from the country and permanently banned from future access.
97
01/04/2021 10:39:32 28 4
bbc
His company have invested quite heavily in upgrading the British works.

It's not like Boots the Chemist owned by an American private equity firm and nosediving. The shops aren't even clean any more. Like the AA, you name it. They are the ones who wring the life out of British companies and take off back to the Caymans.
72
01/04/2021 10:26:24 7 1
bbc
I thin the problem is Gupta's dealings in other areas of his investment empire have been somewhat opaque.
98
01/04/2021 10:39:45 6 0
bbc
"I thin the problem is Gupta's dealings in other areas of his investment empire have been somewhat opaque."

You mean a kingpin of UK business hasn't been totally open and transparent and might have done some shady things??? Goodness me!
191
01/04/2021 11:08:41 0 0
bbc
Yes, I thought I'd articulate that.
65
01/04/2021 10:23:08 22 3
bbc
Did Gupta buy loss making steel plants out of kindness or because he could leverage the assets to borrow more money. But eventually the primary lender realised they were not going to get their money back.
Now by trying to keep them open Gupta struggles to avoid a fire sale.
If we nationalise these plants it should be along side securing UK coking coal and steel requiring North sea oil platforms.
99
01/04/2021 10:40:06 12 2
bbc
But haven't the goverment beed attacked for wanting to open a new mine for just that purpose?
91
01/04/2021 10:37:07 6 4
bbc
Perhaps he should have bet some of his money on Bet365 and Mrs Coates could pass on some of her £469 million ANNUAL salary.
100
01/04/2021 10:40:28 2 1
bbc
Because Mrs Coates is somehow responsible for Mr Gupta's empire? Why not the Sultan of Brunei / some sport palyer / a pop star?