Backlash grows against cut to electric car grants
19/03/2021 | news | business | 3,056
A government decision to reduce subsidies is criticised by the motor industry and UK businesses.
1
18/03/2021 11:03:09 14 25
bbc
small price to pay for the virtue signallers
2
18/03/2021 11:05:02 29 31
bbc
There's plenty of money to buy additional nuclear warheads but not to encourage environmentally friendly behaviours.
300
18/03/2021 11:46:04 7 11
bbc
EVs really aren't the huge leap forward people think they are it just moves the problem. Warheads serve a purpose of national security, with the way the world is going countries are going to need to drastically increase their military budgets.
3
18/03/2021 11:05:28 1226 271
bbc
Good. If you can afford 35k for a car you don't need a subsidy from the taxpayer
69
18/03/2021 11:22:26 518 513
bbc
It's not about affording it, it's about convincing people to pick electric over internal combustion.
71
18/03/2021 11:22:36 56 15
bbc
Agreed as seems sensible to cut it to £35000 vehicles as always seemed strange with all the other tax breaks expensive EVs get to give it to cars costing £50,000 which could be as high as £59,000 after extras added and that is from someone driving one. Better off spending it on improving motorway charging stucture.
And if you talk garbage you should be allowed a computer Removed
201
18/03/2021 11:37:03 39 80
bbc
It's not about affording £35000. If you need a car you have to pay the price. If I had that much money you would call me wealthy and not needing a subsidy, but if I buy a car with that money, then I am now broke.
246
18/03/2021 11:35:18 44 117
bbc
Says the person who is enjoying the taxpayer subsidy for their fossil fuel which Duty has been frozen for over a decade. Funny old world, innit.
284
18/03/2021 11:45:05 56 75
bbc
A charging point is of no use unless you put power to it, the electricity has to come from somewhere and that's an awful lot of new windmills that don't work when the wind doesn't blow.
396
18/03/2021 11:53:52 46 14
bbc
Isnt it more that electric cars are massively overpriced and less useful than a normal car?
404
18/03/2021 11:56:57 36 9
bbc
Depends on the car I know, but they're no longer all 35K Tony. Surprisingly enough there seem to be plenty of people finding that kind of money for planet-killing SUVs.
467
18/03/2021 12:03:14 10 7
bbc
So which electric cars under £35K have a useable range of over 200 miles?
It's about sending the message out there that e-vehicles are the way to go.
Think about the VAT Gov receives on the total cost of each vehicle.
498
18/03/2021 12:08:12 16 6
bbc
It's not about affordability. It's about encouraging people to pick EV over ICE. There is around a 10K price premium for an EV vs an ICE equivalent. If you remove the grant, people are more likely to pick the cheaper ICE car. Is that what they want us to do ?
535
18/03/2021 12:13:44 4 3
bbc
Absolutely correct ! £3,000 is a very small amount, and by reducing the price by that amount, means car companies have room to increase the initial price to fill the void.
562
You
18/03/2021 12:16:44 4 6
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Dimwit tony who can't see beyond first base.
625
18/03/2021 12:22:55 14 1
bbc
Just wait until there are more electric cars than petrol/diesel. Government will need to get tax from somewhere. Either electricity will be taxed, road tax will be increased for every electric car to £1500 or taxed per mile. Either way running cost will be the same for electric or petrol/diesel. Also will all HGVs be electric?
645
18/03/2021 12:24:47 14 1
bbc
Obviously you have seen the price of an electric car with a decent range and decent quality.

A decent quality car costs money, buy cheap, you often get loads of issues and poor reliability.

Also range may not be an issue for townies/city dwellers, it's a big problem for those who normal long trips of 300+ miles in a day or live in more country & remote areas.

Not exactly encouraging me to buy
737
18/03/2021 12:34:54 3 2
bbc
Agreed you can possibly haggle more than £2.5k off the price of some cars or do better when searching round the internet tbh. I think car ownership as it once was is going to be a thing of the past anyway. We'll all be leasing, renting or app sharing cars soon enough
18/03/2021 13:07:19 0 1
bbc
Good, If you can't read the article, you are still allowed comment.
4
18/03/2021 11:06:10 603 33
bbc
It does seem slightly odd to be giving grants to people who can afford a new car. Surely it would be more egalitarian to be using that money to build the public infrastructure of fast charging points that will make an EV a more practical proposition for more people, i.e those who do not have a convenient driveway and home charging station.
25
18/03/2021 11:16:24 168 67
bbc
Do both.
60
18/03/2021 11:21:12 18 2
bbc
Agreed, the subsidy is helping to keep the cost of EVs high, removing or reducing it will force manufacturers to reduce the selling price, which they'll have to do if they want to continue selling, and the money saved from the subsidy can go towards funding those parts of the charging infrastructure (i.e. public charging) that car owners cannot otherwise influence.
166
18/03/2021 11:33:14 8 2
bbc
I'd say it'd be a better use of grant money to invest in renewable energy projects which will

a) provide green electricity for cars
b) ultimately pay for itself
263
18/03/2021 11:37:27 10 3
bbc
Money diverted into the pockets of the mega rich!
334
18/03/2021 11:50:02 4 6
bbc
There are currently down sides to fast charging and too many issues regarding the installation and usage of charging points. Don't think EV's are all they're made out to be, they come with many of their own issues.
Even the better option of hydrogen vehicles have issues but, if all the main issues can be sorted, would be a better option and less messy on many levels than EV's.
391
18/03/2021 11:56:07 9 4
bbc
The quickest way to reduce CO2 is getting old polluting models off the raod and replaced with latest ICE vehicles e.g. a scrapage scheme. Then encourage move to EV once prices drop and infrastructure established.

May be the right thing to do but the Govenment would be too fearful of negative headlines and green movements who just want everyone to take the bus.
442
18/03/2021 11:58:08 4 15
bbc
NA TORIES WOULD RATHER WASTE BILLIONS ON FAILED TEST AND TRACE SYSTEMS ! WORLD BEATING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
448
18/03/2021 12:01:34 13 4
bbc
If anyone was serious about cutting pollution then grants would be given to people running OLD diesels to let them buy newer (but still second hand) cleaner modern Euro 6petrol cars. The whole policy of subsidising new cars like this wont solve the real problem.
519
18/03/2021 12:11:08 3 6
bbc
with hire purchase cars aren't nearly as unaffordable as people think. just drive around deprived areas and check out the cars. Hire purchasers only pay for the depreciation on the vehicle with a monthly payment. no one passes over £35,000 in cold hard cash for a car. I don't think its right to be honest.
18/03/2021 13:44:56 3 0
bbc
Hear Hear... its the infrastructure that will slow this down AND the power generation requirements - where are the Nuclear Power stations that will be required. Solar and wind is OK at most times but it will also need Nuclear to smooth the peaks and troughs
18/03/2021 14:09:18 1 1
bbc
Maybe, but what's the point in building charging stations if no one is using them!
18/03/2021 14:17:50 1 1
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except if the choice is between diesel cost X and electric X+20% people will pick diesel except those who can afford not to
18/03/2021 14:56:35 3 0
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and the power stations you will need with 35 million ecars replacing the 35 million fossil fueled cars!!!!!!!
18/03/2021 15:14:34 2 1
bbc
I get what you mean, but they need to encourage people to take them up so that the price comes down and everyone can afford them. I remember when flat screen TVs came out, you had to pay £4000 for a 32”. Only available to the privileged few. But those privileged few who bought them allowed the manufacturers to invest, research and bring the price down so they became affordable to all.
Mel
18/03/2021 16:02:59 0 1
bbc
Most of us afford it by exchanging petrol , tax and higher insurance costs for a loan repayment.
18/03/2021 16:28:32 4 1
bbc
The grant is misused by those who buy a HEV then never charge it. BTW fast charging for full EVs is going to be very expensive, Level 3 DC (400-600VDC) fast chargers charge at around 50kW . Tesla V2 stations at 120kW. both these require a sub station. Equal to that required by five households. Extra Fast 400kW !! 16 households. It's the laws of physics that are against us.
5
18/03/2021 11:07:00 243 15
bbc
Good move. I don't think as I consumer saw the advantage of these grants- I purchased Prius Plug in Hybrid in 2018 and although grant was added apparently, it was simply the dealer/manufacturer increasing cost before the grant & taking it off to make it look attractive. Not to dissimilar to stamp duty holiday leading to higher house prices & "sales" before blackfridy i.e price hike then reduction
133
18/03/2021 11:29:18 103 159
bbc
Electric cars are suitable for most small urban journeys at the moment. So CO2 journeys could already be hugely reduced now. The problem is the Tory Government has failed to create the environment for people to go down that road.

It should have been investing in far more charging points and giving generous grants to attract people to buy electric cars.

"Green" Tories? No! Just yet another lie.
619
18/03/2021 12:22:29 16 12
bbc
Norway is due to go all electric by 2025.

Already in 2019 in Norway more electric cars were sold than petrol and diesel combined.

And Norway is a much colder country, so the fossil fuel lover myth that electric cars don't work in the cold is just trash.

Its about the "political will" to go green and help stop climate change.

The Norwegian Government has it. The Evil Tories do not.
703
18/03/2021 12:29:45 5 9
bbc
'I purchased Prius Plug in Hybrid in 2018'

Dear oh dear, there's one born every minute!
18/03/2021 13:21:19 3 1
bbc
Yes, a bit like the home insulation grants.
The only winners are the contractors who charge top whack for materials and fitting.
Get the stuff cheaper down Homebase, fit it yourself and at least you won't get a bigger bill when condensation brings your ceiling down.
6
18/03/2021 11:07:16 17 5
bbc
It doesn't say when the reduction will take place. I've driven an EV for over 3 years as a company car and so didn't benefit from the gov grant. I can see the logic of making the grant smaller & on slightly lower value cars to make it last longer. Costs of more everyday EVs are coming down & will continue to do so all manufacturers release new EVs.
435
mm
18/03/2021 12:00:30 0 1
bbc
Still not affordable, you must be better off than most.
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
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The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
12
18/03/2021 11:12:14 16 19
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Any evidence to back up your claim?
13
18/03/2021 11:14:07 7 3
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Have you any justification/ facts for that sweeping statement? I hope you are wrong.
14
18/03/2021 11:14:59 13 7
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You know that isn't true.
Plus the advantages of cities with no combustion are better for the lungs of the local population
24
18/03/2021 11:11:25 11 10
bbc
Absolute rubbish. For a start, batteries are recyclable. Petrol and diesel is not. Secondly, there are vast amounts of pollution and environmental damage done by the oil industry. ICE cars are filthy polluting dinosaurs, just watch the scrap heaps of them grow.
43
18/03/2021 11:19:23 4 3
bbc
Only if you fail to include the total environmental cost of extracting, processing and distributing the fossil fuel before it actually gets combusted into planet destroying waste gasses inside your combustion engine.
53
18/03/2021 11:20:47 5 11
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This is simply untrue. Stop spreading disinformation. We are facing a literal planetary crisis and need to ditch fossil fuels ASAP.
127
18/03/2021 11:29:01 4 4
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Blatant lies. You scientifically illiterate dinosaurs are no doubt the same Facebook commentators who promote anti-vax nonsense and other conspiracy theories. The environmental impact of a fossil burner over its life DRAMATICALLY outweighs that of an EV, even one fuelled exclusively from the dirtiest electricity imaginable.
135
18/03/2021 11:29:47 3 2
bbc
Apparently there are Lithium salt deposits in Cornwall. Technology and the world move on and hydrogen fuel cells are the mostly likely future of powered transport. Fossil fuels are finite anyway - so a specious argument.
152
18/03/2021 11:30:59 3 1
bbc
This isn't true. A recent report was traced back to a PR firm acting on behalf of a traditional car manufacturer. Even with a dirty grid, the efficiency of a BEV more than makes up for any extra CO2 at the time of manufacturing, and the cleaner the grid gets, the more the improvement.
433
18/03/2021 12:00:02 1 4
bbc
Lithium extraction produces horrific toxic waste, and how do sheeple think the electricity to charge these vehicles comes from ?
Gas central heating produces far more harmful emissions than combustion engine powered vehicles do.
455
18/03/2021 12:01:47 2 2
bbc
Rare earths are used extensively in ICE cars also, from headlights, touch screens, glass and mirrors , catalytic converters, electric motors and then in the fuel itself and also as a catalyst to manufacture fuels
19/03/2021 16:44:22 0 0
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Rubbish
8
18/03/2021 11:07:45 780 79
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Unless the UK ramps up its car charging infrastructure the move from petrol to electric is just a pipe dream.
17
18/03/2021 11:15:30 581 123
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As well as extending the range of these vehicles. Sorry but anything under 280 miles just won't cut it for me.
39
18/03/2021 11:18:21 61 79
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Not to mention the harm to the environment of extracting lithium for the batteries. In 20 years time old lithium batteries are going to be this generations nuclear waste.
107
18/03/2021 11:26:22 114 13
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I've still not had it explained to me how I am meant to charge and electric car on my terrace street, where I can rarely park outside my house.
111
Bob
18/03/2021 11:26:59 72 17
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"Unless the UK ramps up its car refuelling infrastructure the move from horses to petrol is just a pipe dream" - ipsa scientia potestas est, circa 1892.
126
18/03/2021 11:28:57 56 14
bbc
I stay in a small village and at the moment it would involve a 30 mile round trip to charge and currently there are only 4 points to service a population of 25k. If the timescales it took to get broadband into my village is anything to go by then it will be nearer 2040 before there are adequate charge points close enough. As you say, unless the infrastructure is in place then it's a pipe dream.
169
18/03/2021 11:33:25 14 3
bbc
It will also need to ramp up it's generating capacity a great deal as they are planning to ban gas boilers as well and shift people to electricity so that's a double whammy on what needs to be put into the grid.
9
18/03/2021 11:08:28 4 7
bbc
With the cost of the new electric Chinese car at £3200, it left them little choice than to drop the grant to £2500!
27
18/03/2021 11:16:48 4 3
bbc
And who in this part of the world is going to import a 3200 Chinese electric car? It'll be little more than a bike. In fact, my road bike is worth more. It might work as a glorified shopping trolley in densely trafficked cities but not in the real world.
42
18/03/2021 11:19:22 2 1
bbc
The Chinese 'car' is not a viable proposition for most, just a short trip urban machine and it will not be available here for £3200
10
18/03/2021 11:10:53 11 15
bbc
Incredible decision. I was due to upgrade to a new electric car but this has made me re-think as it increases the cost by £3k. Madness to treat an industry like this which is already on its knees. We may as well just run our diesels in to the ground. In all fairness I have never had any reliability issues with mine.
52
18/03/2021 11:20:45 7 2
bbc
So an extra £3k is what put you off buying a £35k+ car?
99
18/03/2021 11:16:32 4 2
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Anyone who can afford to buy a car over £35k does NOT need a subsidy from other taxpayers
123
18/03/2021 11:28:29 3 1
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Hmm, either you arent quite telling the truth or you didnt read the article properly - teh reduction in grant is £1500 not £3000.
11
18/03/2021 11:12:14 327 56
bbc
I am 64yrs and i do everything i can to cut my carbon footprint walking rather than use the car, solar panels fitted, only wash once per week, and use the washing line for drying. So many of the two generations younger than me do not seem to be too bothered i thought i was helping to save their planet for their future.
16
18/03/2021 11:15:05 85 248
bbc
Did you vote for Egyptian grapes in our supermarkets or the European ones closer to home...?
33
18/03/2021 11:17:25 52 2
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And you are, fair play to your efforts.
75
18/03/2021 11:22:51 46 2
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Hello
you are , there are lots like you doing the same, be proud ignore the rest ! :)
102
18/03/2021 11:26:00 16 72
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good on you sir. When the wealthy adopt a similar approach i will follow but until then i don't give a damn about my carbon footprint.
158
18/03/2021 11:31:39 18 65
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Good for you for taking action. I trust that you don't fly abroad or take cruises either. But sadly your generation hasn't done enough about climate change, despite the decades of warnings, and now young people worldwide will pay the price.
234
18/03/2021 11:39:57 22 67
bbc
Typical boomer. Blaming those Millenias
242
18/03/2021 11:40:47 12 3
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A point I make from time to time. Tumble driers! The easiest 'green' environmental thing anyone who means it can do is dry washing by 'renewable' energy. Cost? A length of line and a couple of posts at most.
Still it is easier to pretend using thicker plastic bags rather than thin, (never enough times to do any good) is being green and they have 'done it', greenness.
380
18/03/2021 11:54:50 9 18
bbc
Only wash once a week? I wouldn't want to sit next to you on the bus :)
390
mm
18/03/2021 11:55:56 2 20
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Solar panels? Pardon me but you will have departed before you recover the costs of installation. Also, recycling the current type of solar panel at the moment (they only last 20 years at most) is very difficult and not exactly green.
I feel the need to correct you

You should be commended for the lifestyle you lead. I only wish more of your generation wherr more like you.

The problem regarding enviromental issues seems mainly to be those from about 50+

Our yourths care massively about our planet and well be the ones most effected by its demise

Its older people who did the damage & its (mainly) oldies who refuse to change
595
Sam
18/03/2021 12:19:53 14 6
bbc
Extinction Rebellion... a great example of young people who aren't too bothered about the planet.
731
Sam
18/03/2021 12:33:38 6 13
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Also.. home ownership is out of reach for most young people. How are they supposed to install panels on a house they don't own. Perhaps the landlords should be installing them?

I wonder what age group the landlords are in?
828
18/03/2021 12:47:40 5 3
bbc
I too try to walk everywhere but I am constantly hassled by aggressive irresponsible cyclists.
849
18/03/2021 12:50:01 5 3
bbc
I am also 64. I think washing once a week is silly and no way to save the planet. I don't know why we don't go back to very lightweight small engines cars and strive for 100mpg. No worse than generating the extra electricity?
18/03/2021 13:10:47 7 1
bbc
You are doing the right things, so here's another like to round up the score.
My next door neighbours with 4 kids under 18, spend so much time in their two cars, they don't even know who their neighbours are.

You won't get any thanks, not that they've got the manners or the social skills to communicate.

Don't worry about it.
18/03/2021 13:26:10 5 0
bbc
No its only the tree hugger ones. The majority still want fancy cars, holidays abroad, throwaway culture etc....they just pretend they want green until it affects their personal choices.
18/03/2021 13:26:54 2 3
bbc
Hope you mean wash your clothes once a week and not yourself...pity the person that has to stand next to you when you are 6 days from your last wash :o)
18/03/2021 13:34:52 0 2
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I think you’ll find your age-group peers are not like you and are setting a lousy example to the younger generations
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
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The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
12
18/03/2021 11:12:14 16 19
bbc
Any evidence to back up your claim?
15
18/03/2021 11:15:03 9 4
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Do your own research, may I suggest looking at Greenpeace's own site for a start
19
18/03/2021 11:15:53 8 3
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Plenty if you bother to do research
97
18/03/2021 11:15:21 3 2
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The poster will have to phone head office in Saudi Arabia or Texas to check for evidence!
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
bbc
The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
13
18/03/2021 11:14:07 7 3
bbc
Have you any justification/ facts for that sweeping statement? I hope you are wrong.
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
bbc
The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
14
18/03/2021 11:14:59 13 7
bbc
You know that isn't true.
Plus the advantages of cities with no combustion are better for the lungs of the local population
12
18/03/2021 11:12:14 16 19
bbc
Any evidence to back up your claim?
15
18/03/2021 11:15:03 9 4
bbc
Do your own research, may I suggest looking at Greenpeace's own site for a start
54
18/03/2021 11:20:48 0 2
bbc
or look at a really independent piece of research and analysis if you want to if you feel Greenpeace may be biased.
55
18/03/2021 11:20:50 4 3
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Greenpeace? Might as well ask Greta. I'd prefer a balanced source please.
11
18/03/2021 11:12:14 327 56
bbc
I am 64yrs and i do everything i can to cut my carbon footprint walking rather than use the car, solar panels fitted, only wash once per week, and use the washing line for drying. So many of the two generations younger than me do not seem to be too bothered i thought i was helping to save their planet for their future.
16
18/03/2021 11:15:05 85 248
bbc
Did you vote for Egyptian grapes in our supermarkets or the European ones closer to home...?
31
18/03/2021 11:17:18 76 7
bbc
TBH though if the European grapes are grown in heated greenhouses verus grown under Egyptian sun you might find the ones grown further away are still the greener option. Its not clear cut at all.
34
18/03/2021 11:17:38 94 6
bbc
Not all older people voted for brexit. Best not to stereotype peopel you don't know.
543
MVS
18/03/2021 12:14:40 8 1
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Moroccan ones coming via the new ferry service. Much more eco-friendly than lorries driving from Spain
950
18/03/2021 13:01:42 2 6
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How about not eating or buying anything that comes from abroad ? ...or is that a step too far for a remainer
18/03/2021 13:15:23 0 2
bbc
Egyptian grapes?
Since when have the Europeans exported desert grapes?
If the supermarkets thought it was such a good idea, the shelves would be full of German and British eating grapes.
18/03/2021 13:15:45 0 2
bbc
Stick with the global warming and we'll be growing grapes in the UK. After all, the Romans managed it!
18/03/2021 14:01:45 0 0
bbc
Peru
18/03/2021 14:02:09 2 0
bbc
How is this comment even relevant? Or are you just trying to make an assumption?
8
18/03/2021 11:07:45 780 79
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Unless the UK ramps up its car charging infrastructure the move from petrol to electric is just a pipe dream.
17
18/03/2021 11:15:30 581 123
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As well as extending the range of these vehicles. Sorry but anything under 280 miles just won't cut it for me.
92
18/03/2021 11:25:10 101 14
bbc
I always thought the range was the big issue with electric, but then thought how often I would actually drive 280+ miles in one go, without stopping. And I think the only time was a trip to Scotland, but I still had to make stops for toilet.
I think of it like a smartphone now, you dont wait until its empty to charge it, you charge it every night and every other opportunity you get.
106
18/03/2021 11:26:19 89 29
bbc
Then you're in an extreme minority. The average distance travelled per day is 15 miles.
119
Sam
18/03/2021 11:19:14 52 12
bbc
130
18/03/2021 11:29:05 56 22
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How often are you driving 280+ miles in a single trip? Plenty of electric vehicles out there have a range in excess of 280 miles anyway.
177
18/03/2021 11:34:48 12 37
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Needs to be 400 miles plus, especially given the charging times.
Unfortunately for the tree huggers you can’t break the laws of physics.

Will stick to modern petrol cars myself, my current 69 plate has less CO emissions that the same sized Diesel engine. Better petrol engine tech is a far better bet.
208
18/03/2021 11:37:35 3 3
bbc
You can just attach a trailer with another 12 batteries on it :)
213
18/03/2021 11:30:22 12 5
bbc
Most people that drive 280 miles in one day would most likely have to stop anyway for fuel, food, break etc which typically takes 15 min.

15 min charge can give typically 150-175 miles on a supercharging network.
280
18/03/2021 11:44:46 12 6
bbc
There's EVs with the range you require NOW.
Plus, would you seriously consider driving 5\6 hours non-stop without a break?
And if you stop for a break, why not charge your EV at the same time?
My EV has been all over the country, with a max 180 miles\charge, pre-covid when charge stations were few & for between.
Now there's hundreds. Biggest problem is plethora of companies.
2p\mile;clean;green.
321
18/03/2021 11:48:35 5 2
bbc
If you plug in every night (home charge point) you don't need over 280 miles in the "fuel tank"... and most people don't keep their Petrol / Diesel topped up like that. Only fill for long journeys and in electric car that's when speed of a fast charge is equally important.
395
18/03/2021 11:56:21 0 6
bbc
The quickest way to reduce CO2 is getting old polluting models off the raod and replaced with latest ICE vehicles e.g. a scrapage scheme. Then encourage move to EV once prices drop and infrastructure established.

May be the right thing to do but the Gover
nment would be too fearful of negative headlines and green movements who just want everyone to take the bus.
18
18/03/2021 11:15:34 17 14
bbc
Clearly none of their Tory mates are in the EV business yet but give them time. Apparently Door Matt's next door neighbour knows a bloke down the pub, who knows someone in China, who's got a load of old milk floats going cheap (provided the subsidy is restored obvs)...
47
18/03/2021 11:19:40 9 16
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The Tories have done far more for EV provision and promotion than Comrade Corbyn and his Collective of backwards farmhands, sorry, supporters. Constipated Kier wouldn't know an electric car if it ran him over.
110
18/03/2021 11:26:55 3 2
bbc
Is that a chip on your shoulder or a whole bag of potatoes?
12
18/03/2021 11:12:14 16 19
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Any evidence to back up your claim?
19
18/03/2021 11:15:53 8 3
bbc
Plenty if you bother to do research
20
18/03/2021 11:15:55 4 6
bbc
What sends the wrong message is the exorbitant cost of buying and servicing what are essentially working prototypes. The ROI manufacturers have set is turning off millions of potential buyers.
46
18/03/2021 11:19:32 0 2
bbc
That's economics. The main brands are suffering big time in the downturn of the IC cars and they need to suck it up. However, the commercial vehicle IC engine market will run for a long time yet.
109
18/03/2021 11:26:29 1 1
bbc
What garbage. I am on my second hybrid vehicle company car. The first didnt go wrong at all, the second has blown a fuse to the charging mechanism door at a cost of £2.50. The second only requires servcing every 20k miles. You are sadly out of touch
118
18/03/2021 11:18:35 2 3
bbc
Electric cars cost a fraction of the cost to run of filthy ICE cars.
21
18/03/2021 11:15:59 551 63
bbc
So the cheapest/best value for money full electric car at the minute is the Kia eNero.
List price? About £35k. Knock £2.5k off, I can still get a BMW 320D for cheaper...
59
18/03/2021 11:21:08 467 148
bbc
Exactly well said, they are far too expensive and not green - the batteries are a severe drain on natural resources and not my idea of a green future
84
18/03/2021 11:24:13 35 33
bbc
exactly, buying full electric is false economy for anyone but the wealthy
88
18/03/2021 11:24:40 58 55
bbc
Yes, and one can be fuelled entirely by green energy and the other spews out filthy particular matter which literally kills people. It isn't a difficult choice.
91
18/03/2021 11:25:07 22 6
bbc
Well done. But you know what they say about BMW drivers!
134
18/03/2021 11:29:26 26 34
bbc
That's the real issue. And the 320d is a proper car. As for the Nero?
181
18/03/2021 11:27:02 35 9
bbc
There are several available around £25k. MG ZS EV, VW ID3, Nissan Leaf....
219
18/03/2021 11:38:41 31 4
bbc
Try comparing the running and servicing costs too
285
18/03/2021 11:40:04 23 14
bbc
You could get a used Aston Martin DB9 in good condition or Bentley Continental GT for less than that!

I fancy the Aston!
303
18/03/2021 11:46:15 9 12
bbc
If anyone thinks consuming a billion batteries is green they are kidding themselves. Elec cars are too expensive and their range poor. Look around you, are people driving around in 35K cars? A few maybe, but not the majority. I'm not interested unless range gets a lot bigger and those cars (no around yet) won't be 2nd hand until 2028?
348
18/03/2021 11:46:29 18 3
bbc
Yeah but what's the after purchase cost per mile of a 320D? Not including servicing/maintenance costs (which are a fraction for EVs vs ICE) and VED (currently nil for EVs) its about 12p per mile for fuel alone and that's assuming the mpg figures are accurate. For a Kia e-niro it can be as little as 1p using off-peak home charging. Its not just about the purchase price.
469
18/03/2021 12:03:25 9 4
bbc
Yes, but why buy an air-polluting, dinosaur of a car costing over 20p\mile to fuel when you could buy a clean, green, smooth-driving EV costing as little as 1p\mile to fuel via special EV tariffs from power companies?
472
18/03/2021 12:04:05 11 3
bbc
Sorry Banksie, you're wrong about the Kia. Great car, but its high cost is because of the battery size. The MG ZS sells for £28K. Besides, the BMW320d has a list price of £36K, and you have to fill the tank, and get it serviced every year.
511
18/03/2021 12:10:42 6 13
bbc
Why would you want a 320D, diesel cars stink.. It's like talking to a smoker, discusting breath!
624
18/03/2021 12:22:50 1 3
bbc
Better off with a Beemer.
639
18/03/2021 12:24:06 2 2
bbc
Diesel? Meh!
754
18/03/2021 12:37:06 3 0
bbc
What’s so special about a BMW.
794
18/03/2021 12:42:57 3 0
bbc
I've just switched from a Diesel Quashqai to an E Niro, yes the Quashquai was cheaper initially, but how many of us buy a car outright? once i throw in the fuel costs, servicing, tax etc there's a £38 per month difference on my 16k miles p/a. Given that diesel is only going to get more expensive this is a sensible switch for me.
PS. i live in a first floor flat with no parking or charge point
798
18/03/2021 12:43:10 3 0
bbc
And if they remove all grants, the manufacturers will soon reduce their prices anyway, or not sell their product....
885
18/03/2021 12:53:52 0 1
bbc
What about the second hand market. It will not be possible to pick up a decent car for a bargain because you would have to buy new batteries.
899
18/03/2021 12:55:43 1 1
bbc
Absolutely right.
I do so few miles, it might just as well be a Challenger tank.
I could fix the potholes as well.
That reminds me. All the motorists running around in electric cars while the Army, Navy, Air Force get through mega gallons of oil and diesel and churn up Salisbury Plain as well.
At least I do something useful.
919
18/03/2021 12:57:24 1 1
bbc
BMW 320D starts at £38K now!!!! and who buys the basic model
18/03/2021 13:11:21 1 0
bbc
Or the MG5/ZS EV for about 25k retailing at about 22k
18/03/2021 13:35:11 0 0
bbc
And you don't waste power carrying around all those uncharged batteries, 457 KILOS for all the batteries in a Kia eNero!

Say you had 10% charge left, that's like shifting around over 5 extra passengers, the green people never mention that...
18/03/2021 13:55:05 1 1
bbc
You wouldn't want to buy a BMW 320D with those timing chain failures. Re Watchdog investigation a few years back.
22
18/03/2021 11:16:00 26 10
bbc
The subsidies do little other than inflating the price of the car by the subsidy amount and having the taxpayer write a cheque directly to the manufacturers.

If they are going to do it, it should be via the 'road tax' system with further disincentives for petrol/diesel. (Disclosure, I drive a full petrol)
89
18/03/2021 11:24:40 8 1
bbc
Eh - they already have that!
23
18/03/2021 11:07:15 11 18
bbc
Good that it is being phased out gradually. Electric cars are coming down in price, so only fair to slowly remove the subsidy.

And to all you oil industry 'lobbyists'. ICE cars are dinosaurs, soon to be only seen in museums and at summer fete displays, with the tractors and steam rollers. :-)
141
18/03/2021 11:22:38 1 4
bbc
And I forgot, the heavy horses too!

But you might if you a re lucky find a ICE car for sale on the white elephant stall. :-)
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
bbc
The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
24
18/03/2021 11:11:25 11 10
bbc
Absolute rubbish. For a start, batteries are recyclable. Petrol and diesel is not. Secondly, there are vast amounts of pollution and environmental damage done by the oil industry. ICE cars are filthy polluting dinosaurs, just watch the scrap heaps of them grow.
45
18/03/2021 11:19:28 9 2
bbc
The closest power station to me - Radcliffe on Trent- still burns coal. If I'm using coal fired electricity to charge an electric car I'd DEFINATELY be better off using petrol.
67
18/03/2021 11:21:50 2 2
bbc
You really need to do some proper research on this before jumping to conclusions and believing all the hype about electric vehicles.
4
18/03/2021 11:06:10 603 33
bbc
It does seem slightly odd to be giving grants to people who can afford a new car. Surely it would be more egalitarian to be using that money to build the public infrastructure of fast charging points that will make an EV a more practical proposition for more people, i.e those who do not have a convenient driveway and home charging station.
25
18/03/2021 11:16:24 168 67
bbc
Do both.
558
18/03/2021 12:16:13 8 1
bbc
Yes and whilst you are shaking the mythical money tree perhaps fund Social Care, NHS pay rises, and pay off all our Covid debt. It may come as a shock but Governments do not have their own money. It is ours and everything has to be paid for one way or another
18/03/2021 13:57:19 2 0
bbc
Who pays for this proposed generosity.
18/03/2021 13:57:15 1 0
bbc
Financed by the magic money tree...
18/03/2021 19:21:28 0 0
bbc
And the country's purse is in the position to do that at the moment, is it ... ?
Do grow up ... !
18/03/2021 19:54:21 0 0
bbc
Do neither and let the economics have to do the talking
26
xlr
18/03/2021 11:16:38 8 11
bbc
Not enough money. Too much earmarked for nukes.
38
18/03/2021 11:18:11 3 2
bbc
green nukes?
9
18/03/2021 11:08:28 4 7
bbc
With the cost of the new electric Chinese car at £3200, it left them little choice than to drop the grant to £2500!
27
18/03/2021 11:16:48 4 3
bbc
And who in this part of the world is going to import a 3200 Chinese electric car? It'll be little more than a bike. In fact, my road bike is worth more. It might work as a glorified shopping trolley in densely trafficked cities but not in the real world.
90
18/03/2021 11:24:45 0 4
bbc
I think will be a lot.......good for parking and travelling in appalling narrow roads of GrrrrrraaaatA Britain ?
18/03/2021 15:50:21 0 0
bbc
Sinclair C5?
28
18/03/2021 11:16:53 321 24
bbc
You can have as many electric cars as you like, but unless there's enough charging points that people can access then it's just not going to work.
37
18/03/2021 11:18:10 208 23
bbc
and EVs with a reasonable range as well for those of us who don't live and travel only in a city.
51
18/03/2021 11:20:34 6 3
bbc
...yeah, more all electric service stations like Braintree Essex please.
83
18/03/2021 11:23:52 29 12
bbc
If we had asked someone like you 100 years ago you would have said that petrol engined cars wont work. "You have to drill oil in the M East, transport it here in the biggest ships you have every seen, refine it, send it out in fleets of tankers and have petrol stations in every town - it will never happen"
215
18/03/2021 11:38:06 9 18
bbc
and the amount of charging point is irrelevant because whats going to make up the electricity demand wind solar wave cant handle it not efficient enough
228
18/03/2021 11:39:29 3 2
bbc
Not to mention a recharging infrastructure which is both easy to use and doesn't take too long.
452
18/03/2021 12:00:10 2 8
bbc
Agreed but TORIES wont bother about logic such as that !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
503
JC
18/03/2021 12:09:34 0 2
bbc
It's not just the number of charging points. To keep the cars affordable some manufacturers are producing cars with a very small range but these need frequent charging, possibly every day for some. That's fine if you've got a charging point close by in a covered area, but not much fun if it's wet and windy and you have to get cables out and plug your car in every evening when returning from work.
560
18/03/2021 12:16:29 1 2
bbc
There's thousands of charge points already in the UK.
578
18/03/2021 12:18:41 3 2
bbc
And we need the electricity power generation capacity to provide enough electricity for all these future electric pipe dreams i.e. cars, home heating...
712
18/03/2021 12:31:05 2 3
bbc
You can charge at home - assuming you don't live on the 7th floor - so we already have in excess of 30 million charging points.
18/03/2021 13:20:12 2 0
bbc
I remember the massive global infrastructure of petrol stations that were erected everywhere, and the metalled roads and motorways, & channel tunnels, all shortly before Henry Ford was born. That's why the motor car proved popular, it fianlly gave all those bored staff at BP & Shell something to do after 100 years of waiting.

OR

I imagine that demand will drive supply (pun intended).
18/03/2021 14:03:19 0 0
bbc
There are NO charging points in my town of 7,000.
There are TWO charging points in the larger town five miles away.
There is NO ELECTRICITY within miles of the work destination I have to drive 230 miles to reach (perhaps I should run my petrol generator all the time I'm there to charge the vehicle battery...).
I'll buy another diesel in 2029 & keep it as long as I can.
18/03/2021 14:46:08 0 0
bbc
Charging points are alot cheaper and safer than pertrol stations, you can put them pretty much anywhere. It won't be a huge problem to address this. The main problem people have is fast chargers that are faulty, not that there are not enough.
The biggest challenge will be getting councils to give planning for kerbside chargers where people have no private parking.
18/03/2021 14:57:36 0 0
bbc
and power stations!!
18/03/2021 16:25:40 0 0
bbc
It will work for those with a charging point and they will have emptier roads. Win win as THEY say.
29
jon
18/03/2021 11:16:53 33 10
bbc
That will put off buyers making the switch at least until EV prices fall.
359
18/03/2021 11:52:25 15 19
bbc
But the tax incentives for company car EVs are huge.

I get to drive a £130,000 Porsche Taycan Turbo and literally pay NOTHING in benefit-in-kind tax, which is crazy. Still, it got me into an EV I guess, so it's doing what the policy is intended to do.
18/03/2021 13:27:12 4 0
bbc
I don't need putting off. They are a totally useless idea for how I need to use a vehicle.
Good luck to you if you have money to waste, live in a flattish area, never need the heater on, and never journey more than a few miles to somewhere with convenient chargers.
Not for me.
19/03/2021 15:14:03 0 0
bbc
unlikely.
30
18/03/2021 11:17:06 105 62
bbc
The future is hydrogen combusion anyway, EV's are just a stop-gap.
63
18/03/2021 11:21:23 69 17
bbc
It's still an energy-intensive process to extract and store the hydrogen in the first place, though.
74
18/03/2021 11:22:47 11 13
bbc
I agree. Batteries are not green.
78
18/03/2021 11:23:06 28 11
bbc
Hydrogen may have a future in HGVs, but it's a total dead end for cars. Read the science and the economics about it. Or maybe you think the entire automotive sector knows less about this stuff than you do?
93
18/03/2021 11:25:16 18 9
bbc
No, firstly it's not "combustion" anyway- rather a fuel cell. Secondly, they are more expensive to build and the fuelling stations even more so. They don't allow for overnight "refuelling" at home, and whilst the tailpipe emissions are clean, the hydrogen is normally made from fossil fuels with greenhouse gas release. Hydrogen via electrolysis is possible - but expensive.
138
18/03/2021 11:21:29 10 10
bbc
BANG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is what happens with hydrogen cars. Hydrogen car is about £75k. Decent second hand Nissan Leaf is about £5k
631
18/03/2021 12:23:27 2 0
bbc
758
18/03/2021 12:37:59 3 4
bbc
better carbon neutral bio and synthetic petrol and diesel. Fuel from waste and sewage.
18/03/2021 13:16:32 0 0
bbc
Stop-crap - correction :-)!
18/03/2021 14:07:24 1 0
bbc
Rather than combustion, it will be fuel cell technology. So an electric car with a small battery and a fuel cell converting hydrogen to electricity and water.
18/03/2021 19:26:26 0 0
bbc
The electricity used to generate the Hydrogen at the moment makes the Hydrogen solution not so strong at the moment. Solid state batteries to replace lithium cells due in the next 3 to 5 years on an industrial scale, are 4 times lighter and 4 times more energy dense giving the promise of 600 mile plus range in cars.
19/03/2021 09:01:13 0 0
bbc
I don’t think the idea with Hydrogen is to “combust” it, though one can.

Hydrogen can be used to create electricity via a fuel cell, so the hydrogen is effectively an energy store, not a fuel.
19/03/2021 15:08:15 0 0
bbc
no to hydrogen combusion. Just use the electricity in the first place.
16
18/03/2021 11:15:05 85 248
bbc
Did you vote for Egyptian grapes in our supermarkets or the European ones closer to home...?
31
18/03/2021 11:17:18 76 7
bbc
TBH though if the European grapes are grown in heated greenhouses verus grown under Egyptian sun you might find the ones grown further away are still the greener option. Its not clear cut at all.
85
18/03/2021 11:24:18 13 30
bbc
Yeah it's freezing in Southern Italy, isn't it...?
103
18/03/2021 11:26:04 22 10
bbc
Have you been to France or Italy and other grape growing countries, they are grown outdoors
18/03/2021 14:14:14 0 0
bbc
Indeed glass houses also need to be zero carbon as does all transport.
32
18/03/2021 11:17:21 143 59
bbc
Better off further developing the Hydrogen Fuel cell and encouraging more use in the wider vehicle fleets in the UK.
62
18/03/2021 11:21:21 112 13
bbc
I agree. There's 400 hydrogen fuelling points in Germany but just 11 in the UK and just one in Scotland (and thats Aberdeen not even Glasgow or Edinburgh!). James May has sold his hydrogen car because its basically unusable here.
120
18/03/2021 11:20:13 17 19
bbc
Hydrogen cars are basically battery electric vehicles with a bomb added. They are a red herring. Only oil industry 'lobbyists' bang on about them. They are also several times more expensive than a BEV. And there is nowhere to fill them up.
475
18/03/2021 12:05:09 12 6
bbc
At the moment less than 1% of hydrogen production is green, most is made by burning fossil fuels. Pointless!
599
18/03/2021 12:20:10 10 0
bbc
A few years ago I might have agreed with you but that's not what the experts are saying now... " the prospect of hydrogen being a serious contender has faded from view, at least in the passenger vehicle segment."
https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/green-hydrogen-explained
748
18/03/2021 12:36:33 0 4
bbc
Better off developing carbon neutral bio and synthetic petrol and diesel. Keep the current cars and no need for any charging structure around the country as filling stations already exist.
908
18/03/2021 12:56:36 4 0
bbc
The current list price of the Toyota’s Mirai hydrogen fuel cell car is £65k. How does this represent “motoring for the masses”?
18/03/2021 13:20:42 6 0
bbc
Hydrogen fuel cell technology is fundamentally flawed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFPnT-DCBVs
It uses a lot of energy to create hydrogen. It needs an expensive infrastructure to transport and store it. It is better to use the energy directly by storing it in batteries in BEVs and Power Walls.
18/03/2021 14:04:41 1 6
bbc
I agree with that. Battery vehicles are flavour of the day but there are not enough resources on the planet to product all the batteries. There is a place for them but not the norm. Hydrogen from renewable is the future - but the herd has gone down a dead end.
18/03/2021 14:39:52 1 5
bbc
As someone who worked on EVs for a global Auto manufacturer I agree that hydrogen should be the winner but, as with Betamax and VHS videos, the inferior format won. The reason batteries electrify vehicles today is because there are 11 hydrogen filling stations in the UK now. we are 20 years off a hydrogen infrastructure. Oh yes, it's real that EVs are much more expensive to make hence the price
18/03/2021 16:49:22 1 0
bbc
You make hydrogen by 2 ways. One is by selective burning of methane = CO2 + H2. The other by electrolysis of water. This is about 10% efficient. So you can run 10 cars on a battery for each one on a fuel cell. So expect the cost of running your fuel cell car will incorporate this, probably making your fuel bill about 5 times what it is today. Possible but expensive
18/03/2021 17:28:48 0 0
bbc
Oh dear another one on the hydrogen hype train, what does the fuel cell charge? oh yea an electric battery in a vehicle! why bother with the fuel cell with rapid charging becoming available.
18/03/2021 18:08:04 0 0
bbc
You do know the difference between Fuel Cell which generates electricity and water, hydrogen fuelled Internal Combustion?
18/03/2021 20:18:26 0 0
bbc
They are pointless for cars. The hydrogen currently comes from steam reformation of fossil fuels. They also need to still have a battery. Plus to produce hydrogen needs a number of times more energy than it takes to charge a similar capacity battery so we can run around 2.5 times the number of BEVs for the same energy as one Fuel cell car. It is also easier to build out electric infrastructure.
19/03/2021 09:49:49 0 0
bbc
Speaks an oil employee. Hydrogen has its usage but not for last mile and personal vehicle usage. Direct from the supply is best choice. Hydrogen may make sense for buses and long distance lorries. The future is a mix.
19/03/2021 15:05:56 0 0
bbc
no, might as well just burn the gas used to make the hydrogen in the first place.
11
18/03/2021 11:12:14 327 56
bbc
I am 64yrs and i do everything i can to cut my carbon footprint walking rather than use the car, solar panels fitted, only wash once per week, and use the washing line for drying. So many of the two generations younger than me do not seem to be too bothered i thought i was helping to save their planet for their future.
33
18/03/2021 11:17:25 52 2
bbc
And you are, fair play to your efforts.
16
18/03/2021 11:15:05 85 248
bbc
Did you vote for Egyptian grapes in our supermarkets or the European ones closer to home...?
34
18/03/2021 11:17:38 94 6
bbc
Not all older people voted for brexit. Best not to stereotype peopel you don't know.
196
18/03/2021 11:36:49 29 10
bbc
This whole thread started by stereotyping people by age: Not all younger people "do not seem to be too bothered" by climate change.
35
18/03/2021 11:17:47 181 59
bbc
I'm old enough to remember when Johnson was saying this would be a green Brexit or something. It's as if he's full of empty rhetoric and dare I say a bit of a chancer..........
230
18/03/2021 11:33:12 66 88
bbc
Cheap political point scoring.
431
18/03/2021 11:59:46 17 5
bbc
No, surely not! Mr Johnson a bit of a charlatan? You are clearly mistaken! NOT!
532
18/03/2021 12:06:37 17 3
bbc
"BIT" of a chancer !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
18/03/2021 14:04:02 2 2
bbc
They all do it, doesnt matter what party they are from
18/03/2021 15:37:30 0 3
bbc
Your comment is irrelevant to this debate. I bet you make the same anti-Johnson complaint on every topic.
18/03/2021 21:51:34 1 0
bbc
Bit of a chancer! Boris's whole life has been about chancing it and people letting him get away with it until its too late. Just another Trump.
36
18/03/2021 11:18:08 288 24
bbc
If you can afford a £35k+ car right now you don't need help from the government to pay for it.

Spend it on the charging infrastructure instead!
279
18/03/2021 11:44:27 119 94
bbc
Like eat out to get covid?

Subsidised the middle classes restaurant meals
18/03/2021 14:25:13 1 4
bbc
The government makes more per EV sale on VAT than they do per ICE sale as the purchase price is higher. The difference in revenue for the government is substantial - toning that down a bit to encourage people to buy the greener option still leaves HMRC financially ahead. It's not "spending government funds" in any real sense, just in the daft way they account it.
18/03/2021 14:48:11 3 6
bbc
If you can only afford a £32.5K car then you would need government help to buy the £35K one would you not?
18/03/2021 16:31:48 1 0
bbc
Let's not forget it's our tax money,help for someone who can afford the car from those who can't.great thinking.
18/03/2021 18:57:43 0 0
bbc
Spend it on petrol from air plants. Co2 from the air combined with water using energy (solar usually) and catalyst to make fuel you can burn. No need to replace millions of cars, infrastructure, planes, lorries, ships, gas power plants. More fuel you make the more you reduce co2 in the air
19/03/2021 21:46:22 0 0
bbc
Even better, get a bargain quality diesel or petrol. No worries about running out of electric fuel half way to work, much lower cost.
28
18/03/2021 11:16:53 321 24
bbc
You can have as many electric cars as you like, but unless there's enough charging points that people can access then it's just not going to work.
37
18/03/2021 11:18:10 208 23
bbc
and EVs with a reasonable range as well for those of us who don't live and travel only in a city.
217
18/03/2021 11:38:15 15 5
bbc
You seem to have a real issue with this.

Do you think in the next few years there will be 0 improvements in battery charging / range?

Stop thinking about 2012 batteries and start thinking about the future.

This is about resolving future issues
740
18/03/2021 12:35:43 2 0
bbc
I don't live in a city but if we could afford one we would be happy with 150 to 200 mile range as we don't all do 25k miles a year. We average less than 5k miles pa between mot's.
897
18/03/2021 12:55:30 0 1
bbc
Is the Flying Dutchman an EV salesman? A lot of bias.
18/03/2021 13:59:27 0 0
bbc
If you need to travel more than 50 miles a day, then use a different mode of transport.
18/03/2021 14:16:40 0 0
bbc
What would you call 'reasonable range' and when was the last time you drove that far in a day (or without stopping)?
I used to have a long round trip commute of 85 miles daily. A 200-mile range EV charging on a 13-amp socket would have been fine.
18/03/2021 16:27:41 0 0
bbc
Do you put 100k miles a year on your vehicle?
18/03/2021 16:46:04 1 0
bbc
Again (earlier post), as a District Nurse covering a third of Somerset overnight in my full VW electric NHS lease scheme car, I can do over 200 miles a night and quite enjoy a 15 or 20 minute charge break to have a sandwich. It really CAN work. I have no home charger either, so rely entirely on the public network, and have done for three years.
26
xlr
18/03/2021 11:16:38 8 11
bbc
Not enough money. Too much earmarked for nukes.
38
18/03/2021 11:18:11 3 2
bbc
green nukes?
8
18/03/2021 11:07:45 780 79
bbc
Unless the UK ramps up its car charging infrastructure the move from petrol to electric is just a pipe dream.
39
18/03/2021 11:18:21 61 79
bbc
Not to mention the harm to the environment of extracting lithium for the batteries. In 20 years time old lithium batteries are going to be this generations nuclear waste.
113
18/03/2021 11:27:19 124 26
bbc
EV batteries get a second life in power walls. Once they're genuinely end of life they're recycled. So please, enough with the lies.
143
18/03/2021 11:23:45 59 16
bbc
The batteries can be reused in other roles and recycled. The only thing that petrol and diesel are recycled into is filthy pollution in the air.
231
18/03/2021 11:33:38 16 4
bbc
Closed Loop Recycling - Batteries harvested for their minerals and metals ... to make new batteries! It is a thing.
297
18/03/2021 11:45:56 10 2
bbc
The recycling capacity of lithium batteries currently stands at 80%. The recycling capacity of coal and oil is 0%
40
18/03/2021 11:18:39 20 6
bbc
If economies of scale based on the increasing take-up of electric means the prices drops naturally, then a grant isn't needed. Not quite sure that's what we're seeing though. Small cars are being improved to increase range, so there's justification to keep the price high. If you want anything of a reasonable family size though, you need around £70k. Also I don't have a driveway for charging...
50
18/03/2021 11:20:15 2 17
bbc
So the Kia Niro at around £0k doesnt count?
638
18/03/2021 12:24:04 1 5
bbc
Plenty of mid sized family cars. You don't need a charger at home either (you don't have a petrol pump at home), just go to a rapid charger... you can get 200 miles in about 30 mins. Spend a penny then do some rants on BBC HYS and before you know it you're ready to go again.
18/03/2021 19:06:06 0 1
bbc
70k? Try a little over 20k.
41
18/03/2021 11:19:17 5 7
bbc
... not many purely electric cars on the market that cost less than 35K (not sure if it's just the Nissan Leaf) - and you only get the grant if you buy a new car. So they're effectively withdrawing the grant - unless you buy a Nissan.
179
18/03/2021 11:25:40 3 1
bbc
Renault Zoe,
Peugeot e208
Vauxhall e-Corsa
Kia e-niro
Kia Soul EV
Hyundai Kona
VW iD3
Mini Cooper-e
9
18/03/2021 11:08:28 4 7
bbc
With the cost of the new electric Chinese car at £3200, it left them little choice than to drop the grant to £2500!
42
18/03/2021 11:19:22 2 1
bbc
The Chinese 'car' is not a viable proposition for most, just a short trip urban machine and it will not be available here for £3200
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
bbc
The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
43
18/03/2021 11:19:23 4 3
bbc
Only if you fail to include the total environmental cost of extracting, processing and distributing the fossil fuel before it actually gets combusted into planet destroying waste gasses inside your combustion engine.
44
Ads
18/03/2021 11:19:27 1012 45
bbc
I wish they'd incentivise parents to walk their kids to school!
214
18/03/2021 11:30:33 489 39
bbc
Here here. I am beginning to think there is a generation of kids without legs!
393
18/03/2021 11:56:10 37 9
bbc
Well said. Whilst some electric cars may a a part of the solution, the main objective of them is to keep the same industries going and therefore prop up the Ponzi economy.

Real action on climate change would be to encourage walking and cycling, along with decent public transport.
423
18/03/2021 11:59:01 32 47
bbc
It's not as simple as that. e.g. If I walked my son to school and then walked back, I'd be 20 minutes late for work each day, and I would be fired. Electric vehicles are a farce, their carbon footprint is as large as petrol or diesel cars when you consider manufacter of batteries and the power needed to charge them comes from power stations.
426
18/03/2021 11:59:10 38 14
bbc
They'd have to get out of their Burberry pajamas then.

Imagine what little Keisha Rose and McKenzie Jade's parents would think if Connah Dwayne's wasn't driven to school.
491
18/03/2021 12:07:26 15 7
bbc
Time for parent needing to get to work after school run means walking (if in walking distance) is unpractical. Home working could change this.
584
18/03/2021 12:19:11 2 21
bbc
@ Ads You need to get out and stop making assumptions
586
18/03/2021 12:19:23 51 5
bbc
Or they could walk there themselves, as all my contemporaries did in the 80s and early 90s.
777
18/03/2021 12:40:41 24 0
bbc
Let the kids walk to school themselves, they always did in my days before the rags created panic.
907
18/03/2021 12:56:34 24 2
bbc
I walked the 1.5 miles to school on my own from the end of P1......in the 70's, why cant they do that now? My kids walk 2 miles to high school and then back again on their own. No wonder most kids feel entitled these day.
18/03/2021 13:08:57 8 0
bbc
To be fair, lots of local secondary schools were demolished or used for other things and instead, large academies built or re-imagined to entertain students from larger catchment areas which means lots of students have to use buses or cars if their parents drive them in.

Schools should be at the heart of a community not on the outskirts.
18/03/2021 13:13:36 5 13
bbc
Yes. And maybe that geeration might also learn that they are called chidren and not the offspring of a goat!
18/03/2021 13:22:17 12 0
bbc
the very reason there are so many obese children !!!
18/03/2021 13:32:59 16 0
bbc
Why do parents have to walk their kids to school in the first place? I walked to school with my six year old brother when I was five??
18/03/2021 13:52:11 9 1
bbc
Streets re not safe apparently, and cannot show off your Wayne Wover if youre on youre shanks pony...
18/03/2021 13:58:04 4 0
bbc
Just wait until they all get cars where very short trips have no disadvantages....no engine to warm up, no running rich, no extra wear and tear. They'll barely use their legs!
Don't incentivize, unless you have a genuine medical reason to drive your child to school, just make it illegal and fine them say £1,000 a time for driving a journey of less than 1 mile, which is very walkable. This is the generation that want a clean planet, well prove it and also provide a fitter level of person, so as not to increase the burden on the NHS now and in years to come. Simple.
18/03/2021 15:09:11 0 5
bbc
So in the countryside where schools can be miles away over country lanes with no paths please tell me how it is possible to safely walk children to school, especially in winter with bad weather and no street lighting
18/03/2021 15:49:55 3 1
bbc
We have a row of SUVs outside the local primary school every morning. But most have only been driven 200 yards so not much of a carbon issue to worry about.
24
18/03/2021 11:11:25 11 10
bbc
Absolute rubbish. For a start, batteries are recyclable. Petrol and diesel is not. Secondly, there are vast amounts of pollution and environmental damage done by the oil industry. ICE cars are filthy polluting dinosaurs, just watch the scrap heaps of them grow.
45
18/03/2021 11:19:28 9 2
bbc
The closest power station to me - Radcliffe on Trent- still burns coal. If I'm using coal fired electricity to charge an electric car I'd DEFINATELY be better off using petrol.
20
18/03/2021 11:15:55 4 6
bbc
What sends the wrong message is the exorbitant cost of buying and servicing what are essentially working prototypes. The ROI manufacturers have set is turning off millions of potential buyers.
46
18/03/2021 11:19:32 0 2
bbc
That's economics. The main brands are suffering big time in the downturn of the IC cars and they need to suck it up. However, the commercial vehicle IC engine market will run for a long time yet.
18
18/03/2021 11:15:34 17 14
bbc
Clearly none of their Tory mates are in the EV business yet but give them time. Apparently Door Matt's next door neighbour knows a bloke down the pub, who knows someone in China, who's got a load of old milk floats going cheap (provided the subsidy is restored obvs)...
47
18/03/2021 11:19:40 9 16
bbc
The Tories have done far more for EV provision and promotion than Comrade Corbyn and his Collective of backwards farmhands, sorry, supporters. Constipated Kier wouldn't know an electric car if it ran him over.
105
18/03/2021 11:26:10 2 2
bbc
Not advocating either, but how would they if they've never been in government...
160
18/03/2021 11:31:41 3 2
bbc
Remind me again, when were Corbyn or Starmer in a position of power to do anything, about anything? Not sure if you understand how governments and politics works. People in power can do things, people not in power can't do anything.
48
18/03/2021 11:19:43 501 22
bbc
Wait for the battery tax as petrol sales fall (and hence fuel duty falls).

EVs might be cheap to run, but as soon as there's enough take up, then tax on them will go sky high.
76
18/03/2021 11:22:56 138 68
bbc
you can charge them from a domestic 13A socket - difficult to see how HMG can differentiate between charging a car and putting the kettle on
210
18/03/2021 11:29:03 35 5
bbc
As there is GPS in pretty much everything now, the tax will most likely be on mileage, with variable rates for time of day and congested routes.
579
18/03/2021 12:18:54 6 0
bbc
It will road milagge Charging, the Infrastructure is already built secretly that no realises the Road Tax cameras all ready monitor the road network so soon they will send bills out for miles covered to replace petrol duty.
722
18/03/2021 12:32:31 8 1
bbc
Agree, look what happened when the government convinced people to move to diesel cars with the 10p per litre cheaper than petrol con.
846
18/03/2021 12:49:32 6 1
bbc
Toll roads everywhere, charged per mile, on sliding tariffs to discourage peak time driving. Maybe more kids will walk/cycle to school.
Don’t let local authorities set charges though, some loony left councils will milk the motorist.
18/03/2021 13:17:37 1 2
bbc
And then they'll come to harvest your mind energy, like they did in The Matrix, because insane paranoid ramblings are totally equivanet to actual thinking or facts.
18/03/2021 13:24:49 3 0
bbc
They will be charging all motorists on a pay per mile basis to offset all fuel and vehicle duty income
18/03/2021 13:42:10 4 1
bbc
Won't be long, they added a extra tax to batteries used in Vaping Devices also cotton and wire.

Cannot remember whether it was the UK or EU who decided on it but they were losing money from people not buying cig's so had to hit the Vaping industry so prices increased.

That will happen with car's as well apart from Tesla who make there own batteries, but other companies who don't will pay extra.
18/03/2021 13:55:40 0 0
bbc
Of course, how else can we afford to pay for our hospitals, schools, police and public services.
18/03/2021 13:57:13 1 0
bbc
Road pricing is more realistic, I.e gantries on smart motorway charging pence per mile.
49
18/03/2021 11:20:12 30 8
bbc
I’ll buy an electric vehicle when I’m in need of a mobility scooter by which time there might be enough charging points.
40
18/03/2021 11:18:39 20 6
bbc
If economies of scale based on the increasing take-up of electric means the prices drops naturally, then a grant isn't needed. Not quite sure that's what we're seeing though. Small cars are being improved to increase range, so there's justification to keep the price high. If you want anything of a reasonable family size though, you need around £70k. Also I don't have a driveway for charging...
50
18/03/2021 11:20:15 2 17
bbc
So the Kia Niro at around £0k doesnt count?
70
18/03/2021 11:22:29 7 1
bbc
I really doubt its £0k. If it is you won't need a grant to buy one will you!
247
18/03/2021 11:35:39 3 1
bbc
I'll decline even though you are giving them away.
325
18/03/2021 11:49:00 0 2
bbc
RRP price range £32,845 - £39,395

The £0 refers to the company tax
648
18/03/2021 12:25:18 0 0
bbc
KIA Nero price £25,000
28
18/03/2021 11:16:53 321 24
bbc
You can have as many electric cars as you like, but unless there's enough charging points that people can access then it's just not going to work.
51
18/03/2021 11:20:34 6 3
bbc
...yeah, more all electric service stations like Braintree Essex please.
10
18/03/2021 11:10:53 11 15
bbc
Incredible decision. I was due to upgrade to a new electric car but this has made me re-think as it increases the cost by £3k. Madness to treat an industry like this which is already on its knees. We may as well just run our diesels in to the ground. In all fairness I have never had any reliability issues with mine.
52
18/03/2021 11:20:45 7 2
bbc
So an extra £3k is what put you off buying a £35k+ car?
101
18/03/2021 11:25:47 0 5
bbc
Yes it's tipped the balance for me. Clearly HMG want us to keep our ICEs and not kick-start the car industry
7
18/03/2021 11:07:36 30 30
bbc
The materials and processes used to produce electric cars, especially the batteries manufactured from rare earth materials, are more harmful to the environment in the long term than fossil fuelled cars.
53
18/03/2021 11:20:47 5 11
bbc
This is simply untrue. Stop spreading disinformation. We are facing a literal planetary crisis and need to ditch fossil fuels ASAP.
15
18/03/2021 11:15:03 9 4
bbc
Do your own research, may I suggest looking at Greenpeace's own site for a start
54
18/03/2021 11:20:48 0 2
bbc
or look at a really independent piece of research and analysis if you want to if you feel Greenpeace may be biased.
15
18/03/2021 11:15:03 9 4
bbc
Do your own research, may I suggest looking at Greenpeace's own site for a start
55
18/03/2021 11:20:50 4 3
bbc
Greenpeace? Might as well ask Greta. I'd prefer a balanced source please.
56
18/03/2021 11:20:55 4 5
bbc
It should be part of a 'scrappage' scheme. So people are encouraged to get rid of their ICE cars in favour of an electric one - or even some other electric assisted/powered wheeled transport.
57
18/03/2021 11:21:07 24 7
bbc
No electric car for me until the price drops and they build a suitable one which accommodates my dog and able to carry loads. Then get rid of the subsidy.
259
18/03/2021 11:42:28 9 6
bbc
MG5 is an estate car, is that no good to you? Also pretty good value - can be found for under £20k.....
18/03/2021 19:08:31 0 0
bbc
MG5 is one of the cheapest EVs around but it has a good sized battery and range, plenty of equipment and is very dog friendly.
19/03/2021 15:17:50 0 0
bbc
don't forget the range to get the milk and bread from John O'Groats. Whilst towing the caravan.
58
18/03/2021 11:21:07 178 16
bbc
No it doesn't. Car Manufacturers just add the grant to the price of the car. There should be no grants and I won't be buying one until the price comes down. How can an electric car be so much more than a conventional diesel / petrol car? All the complicated mechanical bits have been removed!!!!
68
18/03/2021 11:22:21 36 33
bbc
With more complicated batteries.
81
18/03/2021 11:23:31 6 2
bbc
I take your point, but I think it's the batteries that cost so much.
139
18/03/2021 11:22:00 4 6
bbc
and replaced with complicated electronic bits! SMH
142
18/03/2021 11:23:08 9 6
bbc
Cost of the battery is high. Lifetime cost of running the vehicle is much lower though
302
18/03/2021 11:46:14 11 1
bbc
exactly. HM gov't reduced support for solar panels and (almost overnight) the installation costs came down to match.

Everything this gov't has "supported" financially has resulted in a market price increase to adsorb the "support" . For example - Help to Buy homes has only led to higher prices overall and more profit for the building industry. Just waiting for the bubble to burst (again)
305
18/03/2021 11:46:32 5 3
bbc
You pay for the development costs.
18/03/2021 13:32:28 7 2
bbc
Complicated mechanical bits removed! Don't kid yourself. Manufacturers will ensure enough complexity to justify the need for an annual service at inflated prices. Prices will only go up and up.
18/03/2021 13:34:44 2 4
bbc
How can you not understand anything?

How is it that a diamond - just a rock - costs more than gold, which is just metal, and yet a packet of highly-engineered LEDs only costs 50p?
18/03/2021 15:51:03 1 2
bbc
You just don't understand. ICE cars are expensive but they are incredible value for what you get. EVs don't yet have the economies of scale to be profitable; manufacturers are investing to protect their futures, not for profits today.
18/03/2021 15:55:36 0 0
bbc
Economies of scale, produce 9M cars per year as Toyota does or produce 0.5M as Tesla does. Costs of setting up a highly efficient assembly plant can be then split up a lot more.

No 2030 sudden cutoff, the government should auction off allowances for petrol/diesel car sales. As this cap reduces to 0, the cost of diesel and petrol cars increases. Less profit for electric cars from bad grant!
18/03/2021 21:49:28 0 0
bbc
The price will never come down. The Lithium is a finite resource that will be depleted very quickly once everyone who can will buy one.
18/03/2021 23:00:04 0 0
bbc
Not familiar with economy of scales are we.
19/03/2021 11:27:50 0 0
bbc
You're right. If they were made at the same scale, they would be cheaper than ICE cars and less polluting to produce. That time will come.
21
18/03/2021 11:15:59 551 63
bbc
So the cheapest/best value for money full electric car at the minute is the Kia eNero.
List price? About £35k. Knock £2.5k off, I can still get a BMW 320D for cheaper...
59
18/03/2021 11:21:08 467 148
bbc
Exactly well said, they are far too expensive and not green - the batteries are a severe drain on natural resources and not my idea of a green future
172
18/03/2021 11:33:43 30 34
bbc
you also find that recycling the spent battery at the end of its life is difficult.
677
18/03/2021 12:27:41 2 3
bbc
Totally agree, and what about the toxicity involved in eventually getting rid of the batteries. Plus how are we going to power all the electricity needed to charge the batteries if everyone switched? - I'll bet it won't be "green" power.
709
18/03/2021 12:30:29 1 2
bbc
what I about the severe fumes I have to breath in every day walking to work!?
4
18/03/2021 11:06:10 603 33
bbc
It does seem slightly odd to be giving grants to people who can afford a new car. Surely it would be more egalitarian to be using that money to build the public infrastructure of fast charging points that will make an EV a more practical proposition for more people, i.e those who do not have a convenient driveway and home charging station.
60
18/03/2021 11:21:12 18 2
bbc
Agreed, the subsidy is helping to keep the cost of EVs high, removing or reducing it will force manufacturers to reduce the selling price, which they'll have to do if they want to continue selling, and the money saved from the subsidy can go towards funding those parts of the charging infrastructure (i.e. public charging) that car owners cannot otherwise influence.
61
18/03/2021 11:21:19 6 10
bbc
The problem is that due to Brexit the car industry is beginning to view the UK as a industrial backwater and will, are less willing to invest billions in electric car infrastructure or battery manufacturing plants, the government can bring in policy’s that make the UK seem greener but it can’t and won’t happen without large scale foreign investment and continued government support.
32
18/03/2021 11:17:21 143 59
bbc
Better off further developing the Hydrogen Fuel cell and encouraging more use in the wider vehicle fleets in the UK.
62
18/03/2021 11:21:21 112 13
bbc
I agree. There's 400 hydrogen fuelling points in Germany but just 11 in the UK and just one in Scotland (and thats Aberdeen not even Glasgow or Edinburgh!). James May has sold his hydrogen car because its basically unusable here.
221
18/03/2021 11:39:04 5 9
bbc
Why did he buy it then? Such a Wally
563
18/03/2021 12:16:51 5 0
bbc
Hope that they all have'nt forgotten the Hindenberg!! (Liquid) Hydrogn needs a very robust safety infrastructure
945
18/03/2021 12:26:18 0 0
bbc
Wow - I wonder how he will get about now, only got another 5 cars to choose from in his garage :-)
18/03/2021 15:24:15 0 0
bbc
Being a petrolhead, May should have known that before he bought a hydrogen-fuelled car!
19/03/2021 15:07:25 0 0
bbc
and folk say there aren't enough charge points
30
18/03/2021 11:17:06 105 62
bbc
The future is hydrogen combusion anyway, EV's are just a stop-gap.
63
18/03/2021 11:21:23 69 17
bbc
It's still an energy-intensive process to extract and store the hydrogen in the first place, though.
209
18/03/2021 11:28:15 16 12
bbc
Ignore the hydrogen people. They all work for the oil industry.
233
18/03/2021 11:39:46 3 9
bbc
at the moment
277
18/03/2021 11:44:08 10 8
bbc
but you can use off-peak Green energy to manage the supply of energy for Hydrogen production
18/03/2021 14:10:28 0 0
bbc
Yes, the energy must come from renewables. I don't know how efficient the hydrogen product or the fuel cells are.
MT
18/03/2021 14:47:38 0 0
bbc
To extract hydrogen would result in a fuel about 5 times dearer than hydrocarbons. The sad thing is the ICE debate was hijacked, when there were so many more technical innovations that exist now that would have meant 100 miles per gallon and vastly reduced emissions, and yet many of the green lobby were suggesting log burners, which are even worse than ICE's.
18/03/2021 15:54:04 1 0
bbc
But can be done with 'off peak' electricity, like all those wind farms whirling away at night.
18/03/2021 16:41:52 0 0
bbc
The most effective way of creating hydrogen is to crack methane( natural gas) creating CO2 as a byproduct
18/03/2021 21:21:36 0 0
bbc
but at least you can store hydrogen far more cheaply than you can store electricity and for far longer. Ultimately hydrogen and electricity will interchange: one for medium (longer than a day) energy storage, the other for energy consumption at point of us (a battery)
18/03/2021 22:17:20 0 0
bbc
The cost of any newtech is expensive at the point of roll-out, but rather like the spread of petrol stations. It will become widely available a relatively cheap, using a catalyst to store Hydrogen is quite safe and easy. However I'm sure that using it to produce electricity on demand driving electric motors will be the best tech route.
19/03/2021 15:08:35 0 0
bbc
a ton of energy in and much less out.
E cars pollute like everyone else. Time will come when future generations will face piles of unrecyclables batteries, leaking , realising chemicals into ground waters.
E cars industry pollutes as bad as any other one. Have a look at the plants , factories producing them and their components. I won't be getting rid of my TDI any time soon. They won't force me into buying schemes or rathers scams.
65
18/03/2021 11:21:36 5 14
bbc
Meanwhile the Tories keep subsidies on petrol (by freezing duty) going. Frankly anyone who ever believed Tory lies that they were somehow going to go green needs to wake up. The Tories are the party of oil, pollution, filth, incompetence, scientific illiteracy and corruption. Truly the most unpleasant, and most dangerous group of politicians in UK history.
805
18/03/2021 12:43:59 0 0
bbc
“This was a party political broadcast, brought to you by...”
66
18/03/2021 11:21:47 262 30
bbc
This is one of the dumbest subsidies of all time. It lines the pockets of those that can afford, what is for most of us, a very expensive car. The money would be much better deployed either funding research into green tech (eg hydrogen) or insulating homes.
175
18/03/2021 11:34:25 55 37
bbc
It made sense to help get it going. Now it is and is inevitable it should be cut back and off fast. Just like wind power needed the priming. Hydrogen is not and never will be viable Bar a few fixed ‘battery' storage of renewable generation.
240
18/03/2021 11:40:23 2 3
bbc
Assume you would really have hated eat out to help out then?
250
18/03/2021 11:41:24 4 2
bbc
New technology and infrastructure requires investment and early adopters. Early adopters (who can afford to) help to cover those start-up costs. As the technology and infrastructure gets more prevallent and matures, the costs go down and more people can (afford to) jump on board. The only alternative model is for a government to charge huge taxes to pay for it all.
DJ
18/03/2021 17:34:19 0 0
bbc
The subsidy has been an important technology-starter, now reducing as it has achieved a measure of success.
18/03/2021 20:11:15 2 1
bbc
Hydrogen is a non starter for cars. It uses far more energy than battery and so we would need much more power capacity. As for the dumbest subsidy. I would say the oil subsidies are more stupid.
18/03/2021 21:44:52 0 0
bbc
Dont forget some of these people who can buy an electric car can claim back on their tax. Also fleets pay no VAT.
19/03/2021 09:16:56 0 0
bbc
It supports an industry and helps build a 2nd hand market.
24
18/03/2021 11:11:25 11 10
bbc
Absolute rubbish. For a start, batteries are recyclable. Petrol and diesel is not. Secondly, there are vast amounts of pollution and environmental damage done by the oil industry. ICE cars are filthy polluting dinosaurs, just watch the scrap heaps of them grow.
67
18/03/2021 11:21:50 2 2
bbc
You really need to do some proper research on this before jumping to conclusions and believing all the hype about electric vehicles.
155
18/03/2021 11:31:14 3 1
bbc
Can you name the exact paper/report that said this on Greenpeace's website to help those to do their own research.
58
18/03/2021 11:21:07 178 16
bbc
No it doesn't. Car Manufacturers just add the grant to the price of the car. There should be no grants and I won't be buying one until the price comes down. How can an electric car be so much more than a conventional diesel / petrol car? All the complicated mechanical bits have been removed!!!!
68
18/03/2021 11:22:21 36 33
bbc
With more complicated batteries.
18/03/2021 19:46:57 2 0
bbc
The batteries aren't "complicated" ! They're just described as such to justify terribly clever leasing schemes to create a further revenue stream for the motor manufacturers ... ! We are all being conned right now, and the right price will eventually be reached, but not before the public are fleeced of many millions !
3
18/03/2021 11:05:28 1226 271
bbc
Good. If you can afford 35k for a car you don't need a subsidy from the taxpayer
69
18/03/2021 11:22:26 518 513
bbc
It's not about affording it, it's about convincing people to pick electric over internal combustion.
204
18/03/2021 11:37:22 49 18
bbc
It doesn't in the cases I know of, just encourages a second car in addition to the petrol.
212
18/03/2021 11:30:08 14 13
bbc
Called bribery!
222
18/03/2021 11:39:10 49 69
bbc
Then add a £2.5k tax to petrol car sales.....
282
18/03/2021 11:45:02 43 6
bbc
Why don't they just charge less for the cars then?
It seems ridiculous to me to be giving subsidies to people for the cost of the car. Administrative hours wasted, when a couple of lump sum to the car makers in return for a promise of a price cap on the cars themselves........surely that is more cost effective in terms of time and manpower?
283
18/03/2021 11:45:04 109 29
bbc
yes it is..
i cant afford an electric car, those that can are well off, so why give them a subsidy?
324
FF
18/03/2021 11:48:57 44 6
bbc
It has everything to do with affording it. People won't go Green if they can't afford it.
353
18/03/2021 11:51:37 33 15
bbc
I thought electric vehicles were much cheaper to run, if that is the case why do they need to subsidise them?
387
18/03/2021 11:55:45 47 31
bbc
People will be convinced when electric cars are as good as internal combustion, and cost the same without grants, because right now they are both flawed and expensive. Until the technology is sufficiently developed, we should stop wasting taxpayers' money subsidising it and stop demonising the car in general.
555
18/03/2021 12:15:47 6 11
bbc
Not any more... Petrol /diesel are not going to be produced so electric is the only choice soon. The subsidy can only be used by the relatively wealthy... paid for by everyone else.
684
18/03/2021 12:28:14 6 0
bbc
But almost all major manufacturers have set dates when they will no longer produce internal combustion engines and therefore it is ending anyway
686
18/03/2021 12:28:19 17 0
bbc
Along with a great many others; I would never buy any car brand new, whether electric or internal combustion, due to the huge instant depreciation on new vehicles. So the government grant provides no incentive whatsoever.

Many (most?) of us will continue to run petrol/diesel vehicles until there's a clearer picture on the practicality and affordability of owning a secondhand electric vehicle.
687
18/03/2021 12:28:30 5 9
bbc
Well they won't have much choice in less than 9 years time - and a good job too.
700
18/03/2021 12:29:08 1 27
bbc
I hope this silly fad for trendy electric cars quickly dies out.much better to invest in looking for more supplies of oil so we can carry on driving.electric is impossible where i live and i will not be persuaded of the reality of the claims of thunberg and her crazy acolytes.petrol and diesel vehicles must be saved for all of us.
810
18/03/2021 12:44:16 3 3
bbc
No Tommy we need to convince people to stop buying full stop. There is far more waste produced in car production than they actually emit.
811
18/03/2021 12:44:38 1 0
bbc
Well, shortly you won't have a choice. I assume that's why they're removing the subsidy.
836
18/03/2021 12:48:47 1 0
bbc
No.
It's called bribery
916
18/03/2021 12:57:08 3 2
bbc
Some people who drive dont ever earn £35 a year ...what planet are you on ? We would all choose electric if we could afford it
50
18/03/2021 11:20:15 2 17
bbc
So the Kia Niro at around £0k doesnt count?
70
18/03/2021 11:22:29 7 1
bbc
I really doubt its £0k. If it is you won't need a grant to buy one will you!
3
18/03/2021 11:05:28 1226 271
bbc
Good. If you can afford 35k for a car you don't need a subsidy from the taxpayer
71
18/03/2021 11:22:36 56 15
bbc
Agreed as seems sensible to cut it to £35000 vehicles as always seemed strange with all the other tax breaks expensive EVs get to give it to cars costing £50,000 which could be as high as £59,000 after extras added and that is from someone driving one. Better off spending it on improving motorway charging stucture.
961
18/03/2021 13:03:01 2 5
bbc
Nissan leaf RRP From £29,790, plus ZERO Tax, plus NOT paying all of the Tax on Petrol, plus NO Oil Changes, plus I thought a lot of people leased cars these days, so you don't need all of the cash up front.

However if you still need to produce some air pollution, consider installing a wood burner in your house.
72
18/03/2021 11:22:38 367 22
bbc
I've still not had it explained to me how I am meant to charge and electric car on my terrace street, where I can rarely park outside my house.
115
18/03/2021 11:27:52 174 70
bbc
simple; terrace houses will be made illegal in the governments green fantasy world!
148
18/03/2021 11:30:52 16 48
bbc
Perhaps time to deny car ownership if the owner can not park it off the public highway when at home. If they need to rent a garage input should be capable of having a power connection. Far too many houses never built to accommodate this excessive car ownership these days. Often two or three when a child gets old enough. This era practice must end.
220
18/03/2021 11:38:53 17 17
bbc
There are quite a few electric car owners who only use public charging as they are in the same predicament - not easy, but not impossible.
225
18/03/2021 11:39:24 26 7
bbc
Without wishing to ask a stupid question... where do you park now? That's the thing with electric, if we get it right almost *any* parking space can have a charger (lamp posts, 'Armadillos', wireless etc). The tech's already there, just needs the investment to roll out infrastructure and a suitable universal payment plan that allows multiple networks, switching and simple account management.
257
18/03/2021 11:41:54 21 30
bbc
So you are thinking about future problems using today’s infrastructure.

Can you see the problem here?

Maybe one day (soon) we can use the electricity in lampposts to charge a car.

Do you have many lampposts near you?

1950’s thinking for 2030’s problems
266
18/03/2021 11:38:46 17 7
bbc
we've run this thought experiment, as we'd like our next car to be electric and we live in a terrace - one of us can charge at work, and in the city where we live there's a growing number of public charging stations, so it should be possible.
272
18/03/2021 11:43:23 6 6
bbc
They need to have public chargers built into lamp posts. With a fair way of charging for it.
295
18/03/2021 11:45:42 29 13
bbc
The same way people in top floor flats and high rise buildings will.

You won't, you will have to drive the car and queue for the limited charging points that could be miles away from you. If you're lucky!
649
Sam
18/03/2021 12:25:22 4 0
bbc
Looking further into the future, if cars are capable of driving themselves, they can be stored elsewhere and come to you when required. In fact... you probably wont need to own it any more, just pay per journey.
719
18/03/2021 12:32:14 5 0
bbc
As an Electric car owner, I would not have purchased it if I didn't have a driveway.

However, since I have a driveway, I would not purchase anything other than an Electric car.

Having said that, since the pandemic started, and I drive a lot less (nearer 5k miles now), 90% of my charging is done for free using public chargers at Supermarkets and Shopping Centers.
865
18/03/2021 12:51:52 7 2
bbc
This is only one major issue.

Another is that many who work for minimum wage have to rely on their own transport. This puts many in the sub-2K£ class of second-hand car. The cost of electric vehicles and the short (relative to an IC engine) life of their batteries means that after 2030 a whole class of society will be denied their own transport as there will be no electric equivalent.
868
18/03/2021 12:52:03 7 4
bbc
Sadly, the ruling classes, like Caroline Lucas, believe that the sort of people who live in terraced houses and flats should not have cars, but bicycles.
Meanwhile they are whisked around in a BMW 7 series, deciding how the plebs should live.
874
18/03/2021 12:53:05 6 1
bbc
You're not
Home charging is only for the really well off who can afford a property with a driveway
The rest of us will have to use charging stations where you'll pay 3 x as much for your leccy than you do at home & of course Gov will take a huge cut of that to make up for lost revenue
Weird, the rich who can afford them will pay less than the poorer who can barely afford them
924
18/03/2021 12:59:14 0 0
bbc
With a very long cable?
18/03/2021 13:58:25 0 0
bbc
In such places terminals will be put on pavements linked to the same power grid as street lights.
18/03/2021 14:00:03 1 0
bbc
Looks like you will be using the bus - ideal for built up areas.
18/03/2021 14:03:37 0 0
bbc
By magic, didn't you know that?
18/03/2021 14:12:03 0 1
bbc
Yep, no one in UK is addressing this.

Where it is happening, its happening by power "pits" in the sidewalk with posts ,all daisy chained to a street light!!

Needs thought!
18/03/2021 14:51:55 0 0
bbc
Use a petrol generator.
73
18/03/2021 11:22:38 17 8
bbc
Still tax payers money being given away to road users.

Not only are the roads paid for out of the general pot, but the general pot also pays for someones electric car. Why does this happen?
95
18/03/2021 11:25:19 10 2
bbc
Because they no longer "ring-fence" road tax. That means that road tax goes into the general pot.
156
18/03/2021 11:31:15 0 2
bbc
How much does fuel tax and VAT on fuel raise? How many Tax payers don't use roads?
30
18/03/2021 11:17:06 105 62
bbc
The future is hydrogen combusion anyway, EV's are just a stop-gap.
74
18/03/2021 11:22:47 11 13
bbc
I agree. Batteries are not green.
11
18/03/2021 11:12:14 327 56
bbc
I am 64yrs and i do everything i can to cut my carbon footprint walking rather than use the car, solar panels fitted, only wash once per week, and use the washing line for drying. So many of the two generations younger than me do not seem to be too bothered i thought i was helping to save their planet for their future.
75
18/03/2021 11:22:51 46 2
bbc
Hello
you are , there are lots like you doing the same, be proud ignore the rest ! :)
48
18/03/2021 11:19:43 501 22
bbc
Wait for the battery tax as petrol sales fall (and hence fuel duty falls).

EVs might be cheap to run, but as soon as there's enough take up, then tax on them will go sky high.
76
18/03/2021 11:22:56 138 68
bbc
you can charge them from a domestic 13A socket - difficult to see how HMG can differentiate between charging a car and putting the kettle on
96
18/03/2021 11:25:28 37 10
bbc
That's correct - hence a tax on owning a battery instead.
165
18/03/2021 11:32:56 30 4
bbc
Easy to implement via car tax - special rate introduced for electric vehicles
244
18/03/2021 11:33:53 47 20
bbc
Yep. Charge for 3 hours, drive for 10 minutes.
260
18/03/2021 11:36:49 43 4
bbc
Smart charging points. Tax will be added to these, just you wait and see! There's no way the treasury will lose the tax collected on petrol and diesel.
270
18/03/2021 11:43:20 36 6
bbc
You tax the battery, not the fuel. Also 13 amp supplies are no good for fast chargers
286
18/03/2021 11:40:52 16 39
bbc
It is really funny to see the oil industry PR machine on here fighting a losing battle. They will be in full retreat soon.
308
18/03/2021 11:47:12 9 7
bbc
When it comes to tax on individuals, the government always find a way. Shame they don't apply the same determination against businesses.
312
18/03/2021 11:47:22 6 3
bbc
Well you can, as long as you don't want to use it every day ...
367
18/03/2021 11:53:52 16 4
bbc
And how would someone who has no driveway or garage plug in. Trail a flex over a public footpath to their car parked outside their terraced house? Safe!
418
18/03/2021 11:58:22 8 4
bbc
They are very slow to charge on domestic socket.

There is a requirement why all new dedicated external sockets are now required to be registered. Car charging tariff are on the way...
434
18/03/2021 12:00:02 4 6
bbc
You can try that - see you sometime next week when it's fully charged.
485
18/03/2021 12:02:09 9 3
bbc
Charging from a 13A outlet takes a lot longer than boiling a kettle !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
646
18/03/2021 12:24:50 3 1
bbc
If you have 12-18 hours before you need the car again ...
696
18/03/2021 12:28:56 1 1
bbc
You’ll have a V5 - they’ll get you!
795
Caz
18/03/2021 12:42:57 4 2
bbc
The government will just increase VAT on electricity to compensate
807
18/03/2021 12:44:03 1 0
bbc
Because you own it.....doh
910
18/03/2021 12:56:38 2 0
bbc
It could start charging for miles driven, which I believe is a possibility.
956
18/03/2021 13:02:21 1 0
bbc
It takes about 30 hours to recharge fully from a 13amp socket, and that is if you can park anywhere near an electric socket.
Secondly the government will want its tax take back that it loses from lack of petrol sales, that may be through milage charges or road tax.
18/03/2021 13:08:38 0 0
bbc
The emphasis is on "can", but you'll be waiting a long, long time
18/03/2021 13:11:20 1 0
bbc
What do you think 'smart meters' are for? We are already on tight rope of demand over supply. There are people who want to switch to demand side pricing ie when people are charging their cars overnight, the price of electricity is increased. It is the aim of 'market forces', we are the targets.
18/03/2021 13:17:02 5 0
bbc
They will fit them with trackers and charge you per mile.
18/03/2021 13:31:36 2 1
bbc
Ever wondered why Smart meters are being rolled out.....?
18/03/2021 13:38:28 0 0
bbc
You pay Road Tax based on the model of your car. It isn't hard to increase tax this way rather than on the fuel source.

That is how HMRC will differentiate.
18/03/2021 13:45:22 1 0
bbc
The new "Electric Vehicle Excise Duty" that will roll out when they've thought of some new BS about how they cause pollution.
18/03/2021 13:56:33 0 0
bbc
In fact, a dedicated final circuit needs to be provided for the connection to electric vehicles. they charge at full load. EV charge points require particular RCD protection and earthing arrangements that may differ to general use socket outlets and circuits
18/03/2021 13:56:58 2 0
bbc
Not if you've got no off street parking
18/03/2021 13:58:26 3 0
bbc
I'm sure they will find a way to recover the loss of fuel duty and that will make EVs more expensive to operate than at present.
18/03/2021 14:02:55 1 0
bbc
You don't have the kettle on for hours on end, that smart meter they insist you have lets them know what you're doing
18/03/2021 14:18:03 0 1
bbc
.. and have the lead trailing along the street as a trip-hazard?
77
18/03/2021 11:22:58 3 3
bbc
The £35,000 price cap makes sense, the £3,000 subsidy cut to £2,500 doesn't.
I wish all supermarket install electric chargers at their stores to make it easy for all to charge their car while shopping.
30
18/03/2021 11:17:06 105 62
bbc
The future is hydrogen combusion anyway, EV's are just a stop-gap.
78
18/03/2021 11:23:06 28 11
bbc
Hydrogen may have a future in HGVs, but it's a total dead end for cars. Read the science and the economics about it. Or maybe you think the entire automotive sector knows less about this stuff than you do?
697
18/03/2021 12:28:57 6 2
bbc
Car manufacturers ARE researching hydrogen fuels cells.
929
18/03/2021 12:59:28 1 0
bbc
Total dead end for cars?
That'll be why there's massive investment in H just not massively here
Toyota & Honda are in partnership, there is massive investment going into it
More & more vehicles of all types, from trains, to fork trucks as well as lorries, buses & cars are being developed to run on H fuel cells
79
18/03/2021 11:23:19 170 11
bbc
With a £2500 or £3500 grant they are still not affordable.

Cheapest electric cars well over £20K
199
18/03/2021 11:37:00 62 9
bbc
Sinclair c5?
206
18/03/2021 11:37:31 5 14
bbc
Not "well over" £20k, look at the MG electric cars, also the VW e-Up, Seat Mii, Skoda Citigo, these are all "around 20k" brand new, and definitely under £20k if you go for pre-reg ones (70 plate). Personally, the second hand electric car market is the way to go, great selection of cars available in the £10-15k bracket. I'm on my second electric car, and will definitely never go back to petrol.
Sue
18/03/2021 12:58:02 9 0
bbc
I considered buying a new VW e-Up last year. Quoted £24,000 minus £3,000 subsidy = £21,000. Equivalent petrol version £12,000. With a low mileage, I could not justify the difference in price. Public transport is not really an option around Aberdeen - only takes you to the city centre not to supermarkets, around town etc. I am continuing to run my old VW Polo and will look for a second hand car.
Bud
18/03/2021 14:55:04 3 0
bbc
My cheap electric car came second-hand, no subsidy, for £6,500. I’ve never bought a new car and never will because they are all at silly prices in the showroom.
18/03/2021 19:18:43 1 0
bbc
Just bought an MG5 Exclusive new for £21,500 , 220mile range estate car, really great car full of goodies.
18/03/2021 19:31:49 0 0
bbc
Skoda citigo is £15k
18/03/2021 21:28:06 0 0
bbc
Utter rubbish. Look around.
19/03/2021 07:56:47 0 0
bbc
Apart from China where they are making a small electric urban car which sells for about £5,000
19/03/2021 15:04:22 0 0
bbc
new yes, used no.
80
18/03/2021 11:23:22 1 5
bbc
Should we plan instead for shorter journeys without the ton of extra metal ? <1 mile walk, <5 miles bicycle, <10 miles electric bicycle better than 60 miles per kWh. Compare to 2 to 6 miles per kWh for a motorwaycar. Big electric cars for everyone would fill up the countryside with pylons and the cities with parking spaces. Taxi for out of the county if a train does not go there.
122
37p
18/03/2021 11:28:18 5 2
bbc
Try living in the country and see how that works! Nearest shop 6 miles - not much fun carrying groceries on a bike (electric or not). Taxis very expensive and not always readily available. No trains with 10 miles!
58
18/03/2021 11:21:07 178 16
bbc
No it doesn't. Car Manufacturers just add the grant to the price of the car. There should be no grants and I won't be buying one until the price comes down. How can an electric car be so much more than a conventional diesel / petrol car? All the complicated mechanical bits have been removed!!!!
81
18/03/2021 11:23:31 6 2
bbc
I take your point, but I think it's the batteries that cost so much.
18/03/2021 14:51:56 5 0
bbc
Replacement Nissan Leaf batteries are under £4k.
A new Nissan Leaf is £27k
A new, fully loaded Nissan Micra Tech is £14k
There's no way an electric motor & running gear costs £13k more than an IC engine & gearbox.

Rip off anyone?
82
18/03/2021 11:23:48 53 26
bbc
But EV's aren't 'green'. Has anyone seen the processing of batteries? Its not exactly a bed of roses and neither is all the electricity to power the vehicles. Stop marketing them like some form of silver bullet!
125
18/03/2021 11:28:42 31 13
bbc
less damaging to the environment than Internal Combustion Engine though - and if the electricity can be produced from renewable sources then surely a step in the right direction?
19/03/2021 15:10:59 0 0
bbc
greener that the current lot.
28
18/03/2021 11:16:53 321 24
bbc
You can have as many electric cars as you like, but unless there's enough charging points that people can access then it's just not going to work.
83
18/03/2021 11:23:52 29 12
bbc
If we had asked someone like you 100 years ago you would have said that petrol engined cars wont work. "You have to drill oil in the M East, transport it here in the biggest ships you have every seen, refine it, send it out in fleets of tankers and have petrol stations in every town - it will never happen"
21
18/03/2021 11:15:59 551 63
bbc
So the cheapest/best value for money full electric car at the minute is the Kia eNero.
List price? About £35k. Knock £2.5k off, I can still get a BMW 320D for cheaper...
84
18/03/2021 11:24:13 35 33
bbc
exactly, buying full electric is false economy for anyone but the wealthy
489
18/03/2021 12:07:01 8 3
bbc
Nonsense, as I just replied to Mr\Mrs Banks: "Yes, but why buy an air-polluting, dinosaur of a car costing over 20p\mile to fuel when you could buy a clean, green, smooth-driving EV costing as little as 1p\mile to fuel via special EV tariffs from power companies?"
Also, you can buy a new EV with a 7 year warranty, battery included, for £26,000 (inc. road tax of £0.00).
31
18/03/2021 11:17:18 76 7
bbc
TBH though if the European grapes are grown in heated greenhouses verus grown under Egyptian sun you might find the ones grown further away are still the greener option. Its not clear cut at all.
85
18/03/2021 11:24:18 13 30
bbc
Yeah it's freezing in Southern Italy, isn't it...?
86
18/03/2021 11:24:18 7 3
bbc
We shouldn't be giving grants for imported cars.

Only give grants to cars manufactured in the UK.

Encourage British manufacturing and innovation.

This will generate more jobs and tax revenue.

It's not rocket science.
87
18/03/2021 11:24:26 15 4
bbc
The government needs to find a different way to encourage people to buy electric instead of petrol or diesel. All these grants do is line the pockets of the motor industry. There is no incentive to offer a real discount. Removing VAT on electric vehicles costing less than £35,000 would be a better incentive. No point subsidising luxury Tesla's to fund Musk bitcoin nonsense.
21
18/03/2021 11:15:59 551 63
bbc
So the cheapest/best value for money full electric car at the minute is the Kia eNero.
List price? About £35k. Knock £2.5k off, I can still get a BMW 320D for cheaper...
88
18/03/2021 11:24:40 58 55
bbc
Yes, and one can be fuelled entirely by green energy and the other spews out filthy particular matter which literally kills people. It isn't a difficult choice.
922
18/03/2021 12:59:09 1 3
bbc
Ignorant of the facts, and also of the word "particulate". Do you really believe your electricity is entirely generated in a "green" manner? When we ALL have solar and wind on our own property, then maybe.
18/03/2021 13:42:07 2 0
bbc
I doesn't have to be 100% clean, it just needs to be cleaner and they are cleaner, a lot cleaner even when the electricity comes from gas
22
18/03/2021 11:16:00 26 10
bbc
The subsidies do little other than inflating the price of the car by the subsidy amount and having the taxpayer write a cheque directly to the manufacturers.

If they are going to do it, it should be via the 'road tax' system with further disincentives for petrol/diesel. (Disclosure, I drive a full petrol)
89
18/03/2021 11:24:40 8 1
bbc
Eh - they already have that!
27
18/03/2021 11:16:48 4 3
bbc
And who in this part of the world is going to import a 3200 Chinese electric car? It'll be little more than a bike. In fact, my road bike is worth more. It might work as a glorified shopping trolley in densely trafficked cities but not in the real world.
90
18/03/2021 11:24:45 0 4
bbc
I think will be a lot.......good for parking and travelling in appalling narrow roads of GrrrrrraaaatA Britain ?
21
18/03/2021 11:15:59 551 63
bbc
So the cheapest/best value for money full electric car at the minute is the Kia eNero.
List price? About £35k. Knock £2.5k off, I can still get a BMW 320D for cheaper...
91
18/03/2021 11:25:07 22 6
bbc
Well done. But you know what they say about BMW drivers!
17
18/03/2021 11:15:30 581 123
bbc
As well as extending the range of these vehicles. Sorry but anything under 280 miles just won't cut it for me.
92
18/03/2021 11:25:10 101 14
bbc
I always thought the range was the big issue with electric, but then thought how often I would actually drive 280+ miles in one go, without stopping. And I think the only time was a trip to Scotland, but I still had to make stops for toilet.
I think of it like a smartphone now, you dont wait until its empty to charge it, you charge it every night and every other opportunity you get.
198
18/03/2021 11:36:57 10 18
bbc
Not everyone has your driving pattern :-)

It is only 150 miles to my sister-in-laws, but there is no option to charge within miles of the destination, and there isn't likely to be, since the nearest parking is 400 yards from her home.

And if I suggest to SWMBO that we need to set off earlier to charge up on the way back, I'll need to talk to my dentist...
265
18/03/2021 11:38:43 6 6
bbc
But a toilet stop at services would take what 5-10 minutes then you'd be on your way again, in an electric car you're adding on a lot more than that to recharge before you can set off, this adds on a lot of time for a journey up to scotland
310
HKJ
18/03/2021 11:47:15 3 12
bbc
And that's a problem - you're not supposed to charge it at every opportunity as it develops a memory for it, and gradually depletes the maximum charge. You're actually doing yourself over by being so short sighted.
344
18/03/2021 11:51:23 2 2
bbc
I agree - I had a PHEV with 28 mile range - I live within 10 miles of work - and tend to exercise in the same area - charged it nightly - filled it up petrol about once every four months - and sometimes only because the system told me to use the fuel to keep the petrol engine fresh. Range is not an issue at all for me - although realise everyone has different circumstances.
351
18/03/2021 11:51:32 5 2
bbc
I thought the same, key seems to be the 10 minute charge range. This is now 140 miles for Tesla.
397
18/03/2021 11:54:45 0 3
bbc
Sounds like a lot of hassle for no benefit.
30
18/03/2021 11:17:06 105 62
bbc
The future is hydrogen combusion anyway, EV's are just a stop-gap.
93
18/03/2021 11:25:16 18 9
bbc
No, firstly it's not "combustion" anyway- rather a fuel cell. Secondly, they are more expensive to build and the fuelling stations even more so. They don't allow for overnight "refuelling" at home, and whilst the tailpipe emissions are clean, the hydrogen is normally made from fossil fuels with greenhouse gas release. Hydrogen via electrolysis is possible - but expensive.
18/03/2021 17:02:08 3 0
bbc
Electrolysis is 10% efficient. Why not charge a battery instead?
94
18/03/2021 11:25:16 1 7
bbc
Quite right too, should all go. Just raise taxes on fossil fuel using cars. Time to shift the pressure across in a way that raises taxes, we need all we can get. Car drivers are well off. Fewer than ever are, or will be wanted at all as millions change to working and living at home. No one needs to drive out to towns to shop etc. now.
637
18/03/2021 12:23:59 1 0
bbc
This is nonsense. Imagine a young family who need a vehicle to take them all around when they don't live in a city or town with decent transport. A reasonable 2nd hand car can be bought for £1k to £3k and have a range of 500 miles, filled up within five mins. No country has ever taxed its way to prosperity.
73
18/03/2021 11:22:38 17 8
bbc
Still tax payers money being given away to road users.

Not only are the roads paid for out of the general pot, but the general pot also pays for someones electric car. Why does this happen?
95
18/03/2021 11:25:19 10 2
bbc
Because they no longer "ring-fence" road tax. That means that road tax goes into the general pot.
589
18/03/2021 12:19:36 0 0
bbc
They never ring fenced RFT - it has been used for items like education for years
76
18/03/2021 11:22:56 138 68
bbc
you can charge them from a domestic 13A socket - difficult to see how HMG can differentiate between charging a car and putting the kettle on
96
18/03/2021 11:25:28 37 10
bbc
That's correct - hence a tax on owning a battery instead.
236
18/03/2021 11:40:00 23 3
bbc
If they're going to replace a lifetime of fuel duty with a one off tax on buying an electric car then their paltry 2.5K grant will be dwarfed by a 10's of thousands hike in the price. I think they'll be taxing us on road use and big brother will be watching our every journey (and selling the results to Amazon ??)
12
18/03/2021 11:12:14 16 19
bbc
Any evidence to back up your claim?
97
18/03/2021 11:15:21 3 2
bbc
The poster will have to phone head office in Saudi Arabia or Texas to check for evidence!
98
18/03/2021 11:15:45 9 7
bbc
Sensible. Electric cars are impractical and the necessary infrastructure will take years to build.
And there's no guarantee that they will be any greener,.