Covid: Germany approves AstraZeneca vaccine for over-65s
04/03/2021 | news | world | 587
The decision comes after Chancellor Merkel said data showed the jab was effective for the elderly too.
1
04/03/2021 15:07:08 53 13
bbc
An apology wouldn't go amiss.
8
04/03/2021 15:09:09 79 5
bbc
They needn't apologise to the UK, but I think they have some explaining to do domestically as medical experts didn't support claims made by Macron and Merkel
The bitter folk don't do apologies. You should know that with the left in this country. Removed
112
04/03/2021 15:29:48 4 12
bbc
Why should they apologise? Needy much?
177
04/03/2021 15:42:12 7 2
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Esp. to all the Germans who since died from COVID and could have been vaccinated. They have been sitting on a stockpile of AZ for a while now. Even crazier when they had earlier complained they did not get their "fair" share of it compared to the UK. (Even though we paid a fully 3 months earlier when it was not known if it would work).
2
04/03/2021 15:07:26 30 3
bbc
Got there in the end!
45
04/03/2021 15:19:55 9 22
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To be fair, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

This vaccine has been available and safe since May 2020. In hindsight we should have started vaccinating people back then and we'd be out of this by now.

But you have to go through the trials to make sure it's safe. Germany went through some extra trials, so what?

If their extra trials had shown it not to be safe, we'd be the ones looking dumb.
3
Bob
04/03/2021 15:08:00 57 10
bbc
Look a bit silly now don't you.
53
04/03/2021 15:21:30 9 77
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Maybe. However, if the AstraZeneca vaccine should have long-term ill effects, who would look silly then? Would BJ look silly (or reckless), whereas France/Germany look prudent/cautious? Time will tell.
4
04/03/2021 15:08:28 43 10
bbc
The silence from Emperor Napoleon (sorry Monsieur Macron)...is deafening
5
04/03/2021 15:08:41 67 5
bbc
France and Germany (and the FBPE brigade) just need to start referring to it as 'The Swedish Vaccine', in recognition of Astra Zenica's dual nationality. Then it should all be fine.
241
04/03/2021 15:54:58 12 3
bbc
But it was developed by Oxford, not Astra Zeneca
6
04/03/2021 15:06:03 136 15
bbc
Oh dear oh dear another egg on the face moment for those that wanted to play politics of bitterness.
272
04/03/2021 16:00:20 5 25
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Why would they be bitter? How is that mollusc and potato diet going?
7
04/03/2021 15:09:02 31 12
bbc
Remarkably petty. But, we should expect this sort of thing for a while.
1
04/03/2021 15:07:08 53 13
bbc
An apology wouldn't go amiss.
8
04/03/2021 15:09:09 79 5
bbc
They needn't apologise to the UK, but I think they have some explaining to do domestically as medical experts didn't support claims made by Macron and Merkel
29
04/03/2021 15:15:00 18 4
bbc
Yes they do.
Macron "Quasi Effective" quip was a direct attempt to knock down the Oxford vaccine - because he was hoping the "French" version would be out in time. Wrong again Macron, wrong again.

Mind you, he should take care now, as the French judiciary are no longer afraid to jail illegality perpetrated by their ex-leaders.
Good.
9
04/03/2021 15:09:26 107 15
bbc
German and French leaders now burying their heads in the sand about the third wave coming to them. The electorate will not look on them kindly.
66
04/03/2021 15:23:28 24 51
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Don't be too jolly just yet... The UK typically has a 2-week delay over the continent. It may well be coming our way too. Not out of the woods yet.
70
04/03/2021 15:24:09 7 23
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True, because those countries electorates can support whomever they truly want, and have their opinions reflected by a fair voting system. Unlike Johnson, whom the majority of the UK electorate don't look on kindly either, for his bungling of everything but the vaccine. But he can rely on a large and vocal minority who'll vote for him no matter what, translating into an unfair majority of seats.
299
04/03/2021 16:03:31 0 6
bbc
and still far fewer deaths and better economy. More French and Germans are vaccinated than English, but you keep telling yourself how great half a vaccine is.
10
04/03/2021 15:09:33 227 26
bbc
No doubt many hundreds, of not thousands of lives in Europe could have been saved had not the likes of Merkel and Macron opened their mouths and given us their uneducated thoughts.
19
04/03/2021 15:12:46 99 11
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And not for the first time either.
31
04/03/2021 15:15:33 26 42
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Maybe. If so it'd be like the thousands of life in the UK which could have been saved if Johnson not prioritized opening pubs, and put Xmas before controlling spread of the virus.
32
04/03/2021 15:15:12 26 12
bbc
Angela Merkel may be many things, but 'uneducated' is definitely not one of them.
52
04/03/2021 15:21:11 16 41
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And equally, many lives could have been lost if the UK had proceeded with inefficient vaccinations! As far as health is concerned, a safe approach is always the best answer. We took a gamble and did well. Could have gone the other way round. The reason we did is that the UK had no other option considering how badly the situation was in the first place!
133
FF
04/03/2021 15:33:39 15 23
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Stop throwing mud. UK has over 120'000 dead, hardly time to be laughing at anyone in this pandemic.
163
04/03/2021 15:39:59 5 6
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there's plenty of doubt
182
04/03/2021 15:43:23 8 1
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It's called playing politics. It was only a matter of time before it was approved.

With the third wave hitting Germany and a very low take up of vaccines, they are likely to struggle for a while yet.
Removed
209
04/03/2021 15:46:44 0 17
bbc
yet both France and Germany have vaccinated a higher proportion of their population than England.
230
04/03/2021 15:53:28 3 1
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Well said Sir!
454
04/03/2021 19:54:48 0 2
bbc
Maybe we ought to take a good look at our own numbers of deaths and cases before lecturing any other country...
552
05/03/2021 09:56:47 0 1
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It was the UK that said YES before all the real data was available possibly putting UK lives at risk. It was a panic move by Boris as UK deaths were so high, still far more than Europe.....
11
04/03/2021 15:10:18 14 46
bbc
People wanting to make something of this. German authorities simply didn’t have enough data to approve for older folk. Now they do. Simple as that. No need for any pathetic jingoism.
18
04/03/2021 15:12:40 24 2
bbc
They didn't have any comparable data for the Pfizer vaccine either so your point is?
25
04/03/2021 15:12:27 3 2
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Awwwww still defending your masters?
57
04/03/2021 15:21:51 5 1
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Politicians overruled their own regulators who deemed it safe for all ages...
59
04/03/2021 15:22:04 7 3
bbc
Rubbish. The evidence was hard and there. Germany and France wanted to play the EU solidarity card and as a result thousands of people have died.
Glad to be out of Europe and their incompetence. Corrupt, incompetent and wholly lacking integrity - very much like Scotland's First Minister. Removed
1
04/03/2021 15:07:08 53 13
bbc
An apology wouldn't go amiss.
The bitter folk don't do apologies. You should know that with the left in this country. Removed
124
04/03/2021 15:32:00 5 9
bbc
What has right or left got to do with it ?.

The Pfizer vaccine is more effective ?, and some of the UK people were refusing to have it because it was foreign. Is that attitude right wing ?

By all means criticise stupid decisions, but just because it was against AZ does not make anyone left, else, anyone not taking the Pfizer vaccine is stupid right wing racist, and xenophobia.
13
04/03/2021 15:10:42 158 9
bbc
From recent reports around Europe the damage is done.

Europeans don't trust Astrazeneca because their top politicians told them not to.

It's going to take more than a belated endorsement to change attitudes in those countries now.
167
jon
04/03/2021 15:40:57 76 5
bbc
Yes especially in France with a quasi-ineffective President. He ignored the European Medicines Agency and WHO advice for political purposes.
183
04/03/2021 15:43:23 2 2
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Very sad that they are controlled by their media then. And not truth.
403
04/03/2021 17:46:03 0 1
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Yes for sure. Didn't see these countries rushing to give back/donate the vaccine!!
14
04/03/2021 15:11:39 3 2
bbc
Whoopee doo Ahaa!
15
04/03/2021 15:12:10 18 10
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Embarrassing climbdown methinks...
16
04/03/2021 15:12:18 17 12
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So Germany is a sovereign nation making its own choices (for good or bad.)
22
04/03/2021 15:14:13 15 5
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They made the wrong choices.
23
04/03/2021 15:14:19 3 2
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That normally doesn't end well...
27
04/03/2021 15:13:56 10 3
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Germany is a law to itself. Only in the EU when it suits them.
63
DJL
04/03/2021 15:22:51 3 3
bbc
No. Germany is now doing as it is told. EU passed the vaccine for use in all ages but Germany chose to give only to under 65's. It is now toeing the EU line. If it were making it's own choices it would have bought it's own supply earlier
... and it’s only a sovereign nation, because we, the Allies, liberated it from the tyranny of the Nazis lest they forget... Removed
17
04/03/2021 15:12:37 58 5
bbc
Ah yes, Boris (and Tony Blair, strangely enough) got it right again! As long as Germany didn't let the unused vaccine get beyond its use-by date, then at least it wasn't wasted, although there will have been unnecessary deaths in Germany due the delay (and their seven day average death rate is higher than ours at present)
33
04/03/2021 15:15:54 60 31
bbc
Tony Blair spotted an opportunity for him to jump on. Won't change the fact he was and will always be the worst PM to ever disgrace our history.
11
04/03/2021 15:10:18 14 46
bbc
People wanting to make something of this. German authorities simply didn’t have enough data to approve for older folk. Now they do. Simple as that. No need for any pathetic jingoism.
18
04/03/2021 15:12:40 24 2
bbc
They didn't have any comparable data for the Pfizer vaccine either so your point is?
35
04/03/2021 15:18:14 3 5
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There was more data for Pfizer. Their over 65 sample was bigger.
10
04/03/2021 15:09:33 227 26
bbc
No doubt many hundreds, of not thousands of lives in Europe could have been saved had not the likes of Merkel and Macron opened their mouths and given us their uneducated thoughts.
19
04/03/2021 15:12:46 99 11
bbc
And not for the first time either.
20
04/03/2021 15:13:02 55 10
bbc
Well done Germany, only a couple of months behind now.

#betteroffout
331
04/03/2021 16:20:00 3 19
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actually Germany has vaccinated more of its citizens than England, half a vaccine is just that. #liedtoagain
21
04/03/2021 15:14:02 73 10
bbc
German and French politics cost lives
318
04/03/2021 16:14:23 4 17
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but far fewer than English politics under Borinochio.
16
04/03/2021 15:12:18 17 12
bbc
So Germany is a sovereign nation making its own choices (for good or bad.)
22
04/03/2021 15:14:13 15 5
bbc
They made the wrong choices.
16
04/03/2021 15:12:18 17 12
bbc
So Germany is a sovereign nation making its own choices (for good or bad.)
23
04/03/2021 15:14:19 3 2
bbc
That normally doesn't end well...
24
DJP
04/03/2021 15:14:22 114 5
bbc
Well done Oxford and Swedish Scientists for a great vaccine.

Cheap enough for supply to the poorer countries, and our rich neighbours too.
72
04/03/2021 15:19:30 44 14
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We have funded "poor" countries for years only to fund champagne dictatorships in their gated mansions whilst the people starve.
297
04/03/2021 16:01:54 0 5
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yet more expensive for the English...
578
05/03/2021 14:26:28 0 1
bbc
Yes congratulations to those European science boffins creating these vaccines and organising those international trials combined with those European Manufacturing companies making the vaccine. Nice England were able to find two English science bods to help sure they made a massive contribution. Without Europe this would have gone no where. UK has almost zero capacity to manufacturing vaccines
11
04/03/2021 15:10:18 14 46
bbc
People wanting to make something of this. German authorities simply didn’t have enough data to approve for older folk. Now they do. Simple as that. No need for any pathetic jingoism.
25
04/03/2021 15:12:27 3 2
bbc
Awwwww still defending your masters?
26
04/03/2021 15:13:52 95 11
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Find it very sad because of politics (Macron probably the biggest offender) that many are losing their lives and many will because of the EU incompetence...
144
04/03/2021 15:36:27 25 4
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it may not just be politics... for the likes of Phizer there are huge financial implications... so the money men may also be pushing anti-AZ spin. Politiicans are notoriously short-termists, money men can be criminally cynical
304
04/03/2021 16:07:56 0 7
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but many fewer than in England.
579
05/03/2021 14:27:58 0 0
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Playing politics with peoples lives and destroying the economy you mean Johnson and his clowns
16
04/03/2021 15:12:18 17 12
bbc
So Germany is a sovereign nation making its own choices (for good or bad.)
27
04/03/2021 15:13:56 10 3
bbc
Germany is a law to itself. Only in the EU when it suits them.
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
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Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
36
04/03/2021 15:18:32 17 1
bbc
Not hindsight at all. Most of us said it at the time. We also pointed out that there was no comparable data for the Pizer vaccine but they were happy to approve that one. Without hindsight once again, most of said it was political posturing at the time. It was. It has hurt them in the fight against the virus and continues to do so.
38
04/03/2021 15:18:01 4 1
bbc
Go live there and how "reasonable" it is to suffer. Can't believe the denial from you EU sheep.
48
04/03/2021 15:20:14 6 1
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WRONG! The scientific evidence was there all along. The EU took a POLITICAL decision and have caused the deaths of thousands of EU citizens as a result.
55
04/03/2021 15:21:43 3 1
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What planet are you on?
58
04/03/2021 15:22:03 3 1
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Sorry Bob that’s just bull! It was indeed a calculated risk but underpinned by sound scientific opinion both in terms of speedy approval of the vaccine and its method of deployment. Decisions taken by other European countries are for them to defend but we can be proud of what we have done in UK without crowing of course.
62
04/03/2021 15:22:26 3 1
bbc
The thing is though it was never going to be a no risk strategy. You know people are going to die if they don't have a vaccine and they may be protected if they do. It's a reasonable approach based on a limited timescale and pressing need, i'm pleased the UK government took a pragmatic approach in this instance.
74
04/03/2021 15:24:37 0 1
bbc
Data still doesn't exist to confirm that a single jab is sufficient for those who have recovered from an infection - but that hasn't stopped France, Spain and Italy adopting such a policy, purely to save doses.
Is that a reasonable view too (even though many scientists are warning against, because immunological responses to natural infection vary so much from person to person) ?
86
04/03/2021 15:26:14 4 1
bbc
I seem to remember that a few days before they decided not to use it, they were complaining about not being able to get enough of it. Legal action against AZ was threatened and they even threatened to close the Irish border and break the trade agreement before the ink was even dry.

You say they took a reasonable view. No, they behaviour was petty and ridiculous and will have had consequences.
233
04/03/2021 15:53:55 1 1
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Tosh!
8
04/03/2021 15:09:09 79 5
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They needn't apologise to the UK, but I think they have some explaining to do domestically as medical experts didn't support claims made by Macron and Merkel
29
04/03/2021 15:15:00 18 4
bbc
Yes they do.
Macron "Quasi Effective" quip was a direct attempt to knock down the Oxford vaccine - because he was hoping the "French" version would be out in time. Wrong again Macron, wrong again.

Mind you, he should take care now, as the French judiciary are no longer afraid to jail illegality perpetrated by their ex-leaders.
Good.
30
04/03/2021 15:15:17 86 7
bbc
It was a baffling decision as a vaccine was always going to be a better option than no protection. The data so far suggests that both the Pfizer and Astrazeneca vaccines are providing very good levels of protection after a single dose - also justifying the decision to get more people the first dose.
47
Bob
04/03/2021 15:20:10 12 59
bbc
Not baffling, if the vaccine ended up being poor protection for the elderly then yes you are right to say that, as an example figure, 5% protection is better than no jab and no protection, but you'd be wasting a precious resource. Better to save that vial and jab it into 50 year olds and get the high level of protection and keep the other vaccines for the elderly.
139
04/03/2021 15:35:31 8 3
bbc
I agree it was baffling which is why I think it was playing politics... They were trying to cover their backsides for votes but I think it will backfire...
580
05/03/2021 14:31:48 0 0
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Curious were you get that data because being better than no protection is very low bar to achieve. Then you claim they give very good levels of protection after single dose, is there any published trials on that backing up that claim? All the data is based on the vaccines administered as the companies stipulate 2 doses a few weeks apart
10
04/03/2021 15:09:33 227 26
bbc
No doubt many hundreds, of not thousands of lives in Europe could have been saved had not the likes of Merkel and Macron opened their mouths and given us their uneducated thoughts.
31
04/03/2021 15:15:33 26 42
bbc
Maybe. If so it'd be like the thousands of life in the UK which could have been saved if Johnson not prioritized opening pubs, and put Xmas before controlling spread of the virus.
10
04/03/2021 15:09:33 227 26
bbc
No doubt many hundreds, of not thousands of lives in Europe could have been saved had not the likes of Merkel and Macron opened their mouths and given us their uneducated thoughts.
32
04/03/2021 15:15:12 26 12
bbc
Angela Merkel may be many things, but 'uneducated' is definitely not one of them.
83
04/03/2021 15:26:04 22 2
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I think the point was they are not health professionals they are politicians.
100
04/03/2021 15:27:15 33 7
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Then there really isn't an excuse is there. It therefore boils down to EU politics playing with lives. If this was a German or French vaccine then this would never have happened.

The EU the gift that keeps on "taking".
17
04/03/2021 15:12:37 58 5
bbc
Ah yes, Boris (and Tony Blair, strangely enough) got it right again! As long as Germany didn't let the unused vaccine get beyond its use-by date, then at least it wasn't wasted, although there will have been unnecessary deaths in Germany due the delay (and their seven day average death rate is higher than ours at present)
33
04/03/2021 15:15:54 60 31
bbc
Tony Blair spotted an opportunity for him to jump on. Won't change the fact he was and will always be the worst PM to ever disgrace our history.
61
04/03/2021 15:22:21 7 6
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Actually its a close tie with Gordon Brown.... one fiscally inept and the other spent blood in the sand on a lie.
195
04/03/2021 15:46:23 5 5
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the only sustained and marked economic growth I ever experienced in forty years
was Blairite growth

I only regret his Bush problem
246
04/03/2021 15:56:24 5 3
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That dubious honour will belong to Johnson!
325
04/03/2021 16:15:51 3 4
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yet far better than Boris, who has caused the biggest recession in history.
582
05/03/2021 14:36:54 0 0
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Johnson or Thatcher by far an away the worst prime ministers ever the amount damage they did to the economy mind blowing Putin couldn't have done a better job
34
04/03/2021 15:16:51 84 11
bbc
Macron and Merkel look utterly stupid! As for the EU Commission’s ability to get the vaccine distributed around Europe the less said the better!!... Just glad we are not part of it!

As for vaccine passports, we won’t need these this summer to travel to the EU, as they are so far behind the UK you won’t be able to get there!! You couldn’t write the script!.....
40
04/03/2021 15:19:01 39 14
bbc
As do their EU luvvie followers.
104
04/03/2021 15:28:51 4 1
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Well you might be able to get there BUT you won't get back? £1750 for 10 days in a rotten Hotel in London???
317
04/03/2021 16:13:34 0 7
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Yep not killing 120000 people makes them look very silly. Both France and Germany have vaccinated higher proportions of their population than England, half a vaccine is not a vaccine. So no you certainly couldn't write the script.
18
04/03/2021 15:12:40 24 2
bbc
They didn't have any comparable data for the Pfizer vaccine either so your point is?
35
04/03/2021 15:18:14 3 5
bbc
There was more data for Pfizer. Their over 65 sample was bigger.
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
36
04/03/2021 15:18:32 17 1
bbc
Not hindsight at all. Most of us said it at the time. We also pointed out that there was no comparable data for the Pizer vaccine but they were happy to approve that one. Without hindsight once again, most of said it was political posturing at the time. It was. It has hurt them in the fight against the virus and continues to do so.
37
04/03/2021 15:18:37 26 4
bbc
The Germans usually recognise quality right away. I was surprised at Germany's initial response to the AZ vaccine, especially as Merkel was a scientist. Maybe she should have remained a scientist.
94
04/03/2021 15:27:24 5 4
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Remained a Scientist? Or remained a Communist???
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
38
04/03/2021 15:18:01 4 1
bbc
Go live there and how "reasonable" it is to suffer. Can't believe the denial from you EU sheep.
39
04/03/2021 15:18:43 6 28
bbc
The UK took a fingers crossed approach. In some ways we were the guinea pigs. Now they've seen the evidence. From the UK that vaccine works. In the elderly age group. They have approved it. If AZ had the data for the elderly population. It would have been approved for use in this age group straight away. They were not point scoring as some would think.
81
04/03/2021 15:25:43 7 1
bbc
As far as I can tell, the mistake made by both Merkel and Macron was that they cast doubt on the efficacy of AstraZeneca. They should have simply stuck to the fact - ie that there was insufficient data to be sure that it would protect the over 65s. Casting doubt merely gave people the opportunity to claim political point scoring.
89
04/03/2021 15:23:12 1 2
bbc
No we took the decision cos our scientific community are the best in the world.
91
04/03/2021 15:26:57 1 3
bbc
What rubbish. The evidence was there or as much as was available for the other vaccines. The EU didn't want to accept it post Brexit. Simple as that. They played with the lives of their own citizens. Macrons comments were absolutely outrageous.
109
04/03/2021 15:29:27 1 2
bbc
No they didn’t! The AZ vaccine got regulatory approval in UK and EU without any age restrictions! Macron and Merkel then took it into their own hands to louse it up, without any scientific evidence to back up their positions. The buck stops with them.
113
04/03/2021 15:30:04 1 2
bbc
Fingers crossed? Does a vaccine suddenly stop working when you hit 55 or 65? I know peoples immune systems wane in later years, but to say it becomes ineffective over 65 was at best absurd.
120
04/03/2021 15:31:52 1 1
bbc
The evidence was there that the vaccine was safe and effective, but limited trial data was available for the older age group. There is already a body of evidence showing how age affects vaccine response, UK 100% knew it was safe for over 65s and would be effective - just not exactly. Germany decided it was better to give no vaccine (whilst waiting on Pfizer) rather than AZ. That was irresponsible
34
04/03/2021 15:16:51 84 11
bbc
Macron and Merkel look utterly stupid! As for the EU Commission’s ability to get the vaccine distributed around Europe the less said the better!!... Just glad we are not part of it!

As for vaccine passports, we won’t need these this summer to travel to the EU, as they are so far behind the UK you won’t be able to get there!! You couldn’t write the script!.....
40
04/03/2021 15:19:01 39 14
bbc
As do their EU luvvie followers.
41
04/03/2021 15:19:09 153 17
bbc
Rubbish comments everyone.

This was Merkel and Macron playing politics at the cost of European peoples lives.

Our government have made some mistakes, but nothing as criminal as this.
84
04/03/2021 15:26:13 71 22
bbc
Very true, however they run the EU just like Stalin ran the USSR! in fact the whole framework of the EU is designed on the USSR model. Thousands of people on exhobitant salaries voting but the power is with the elite at its centre
520
05/03/2021 01:22:26 0 1
bbc
Politics? Not at all. They were waiting to see how the over 65s in the UK got on first. There wasn’t enough information then but now there is. As human beings I think we can all rejoice that the results are looking so good.
575
05/03/2021 14:18:42 0 1
bbc
Taiwan a population half the size of UK Taiwan total covid deaths 15. Taiwan GDP 7%
British government have cost thousands of innocent lives and destroyed the economy
42
04/03/2021 15:19:14 47 1
bbc
Confirms our scientists and medics aren't wrong . Hopefully many will choose to benefit from its protection.
43
04/03/2021 15:19:18 8 19
bbc
Undoubtedly, there will be smug comments. Just remember, EU27 are sovereign nations who can decide independently who they want to vaccine and when and what they consider safe. So before you smug off, also have a look at the total number of deaths and think again. This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete.
67
04/03/2021 15:23:43 14 2
bbc
Sorry but the EU started it with trying to deny vaccine to the UK that we had already paid for?
Some democracy the EU when they keep trying to Bully their neighbours!
77
04/03/2021 15:24:53 3 1
bbc
Well the smugness or Macron and Merkel has put them two months behind the UK and cost countless unnecessary deaths all in the name of anecdotal evidence.....
88
04/03/2021 15:22:25 2 1
bbc
Germany is only part of the EU when it suits them.
90
04/03/2021 15:26:46 2 1
bbc
The EU and those sovereign states have made a mess not to be smug about, but to pity the people who haven't had a jab because of the petty politicking.
105
04/03/2021 15:29:06 2 1
bbc
And instead of yet another post on how amazing the EU is, read up on how all 27 nations and the UK report deaths differently, include care homes or not etc.
156
04/03/2021 15:39:26 0 1
bbc
"This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete."

Maybe tell that to Merkel and Macron, you are preaching to the choir right here..
244
04/03/2021 15:55:53 0 1
bbc
That's the trouble, the EU thinks IT is the sovereign nation but its constituent parts don't!
44
04/03/2021 15:19:42 6 23
bbc
Absolute pathetic Daily Mail pub bore jingoism on here. An embarrassment to the nation. Shame on you and your insecurities.
54
04/03/2021 15:21:42 3 2
bbc
Then stop sending it.
Removed
78
04/03/2021 15:25:01 2 1
bbc
Whilst EU states are doing precisely what they said they wouldn't do nearly 4 weeks ago.
They've set their vaccine roll-out back weeks because of petty politicking.
126
04/03/2021 15:32:16 1 1
bbc
Your name says it all??
149
04/03/2021 15:37:49 1 1
bbc
Look at you with your sweeping stereotyping and generalisations...
2
04/03/2021 15:07:26 30 3
bbc
Got there in the end!
45
04/03/2021 15:19:55 9 22
bbc
To be fair, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

This vaccine has been available and safe since May 2020. In hindsight we should have started vaccinating people back then and we'd be out of this by now.

But you have to go through the trials to make sure it's safe. Germany went through some extra trials, so what?

If their extra trials had shown it not to be safe, we'd be the ones looking dumb.
166
04/03/2021 15:40:40 6 1
bbc
They didn't do any extra trials... they just did them slower... We ran the same trials as them but simultaneously, they ran theirs sequentially ie one at a time... Their scientists knew perfectly well what our results showed but politics and big pharma were obviously more important to them than people.
199
04/03/2021 15:48:04 0 1
bbc
"hindsight is a wonderful thing"
Hey, maybe Stammer now agrees with the Germans.
46
04/03/2021 15:20:02 55 10
bbc
As far as France, Germany and the EU Commission are concerned that age old adage about not being able to organise a p**s up a brewery springs to mind!
69
04/03/2021 15:24:06 12 37
bbc
Hm, I would take a long and hard look at the Brexit negotiations and then be very quiet...
30
04/03/2021 15:15:17 86 7
bbc
It was a baffling decision as a vaccine was always going to be a better option than no protection. The data so far suggests that both the Pfizer and Astrazeneca vaccines are providing very good levels of protection after a single dose - also justifying the decision to get more people the first dose.
47
Bob
04/03/2021 15:20:10 12 59
bbc
Not baffling, if the vaccine ended up being poor protection for the elderly then yes you are right to say that, as an example figure, 5% protection is better than no jab and no protection, but you'd be wasting a precious resource. Better to save that vial and jab it into 50 year olds and get the high level of protection and keep the other vaccines for the elderly.
111
04/03/2021 15:29:46 12 2
bbc
50 year olds are much less likely to die though - and they didn't have a huge amount of the Pfizer vaccine either to focus on the elderly. If that had been in plentiful supply I could understand the call but they didn't which is why I described it as baffling.
141
04/03/2021 15:35:56 5 3
bbc
That maybe true, which is isn't. BUT they had no data for the Pfizer vaccine either which kind of blows a political dust over the affair really as they were more than happy to play those risk odds..
266
04/03/2021 16:00:39 2 1
bbc
But Bob , why would a vaccine suddenly become THAT much less effective amongst 65years + , as if your biology suddenly changes over night ! Making up a silly hypothetical number to back up your point doesn't make it a good point . The decision to not offer a safe vaccine to over 65s was wrong and has been proved to be so
313
04/03/2021 16:09:02 1 5
bbc
oh you tried to talk actual science to the far right, that was a mistake.
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
48
04/03/2021 15:20:14 6 1
bbc
WRONG! The scientific evidence was there all along. The EU took a POLITICAL decision and have caused the deaths of thousands of EU citizens as a result.
49
04/03/2021 15:20:19 26 7
bbc
In business it's well known that if you want to slow down or even stop something, persuade the management to form a committee. The EU is a committee.
355
04/03/2021 16:28:06 3 2
bbc
and they have formed the wealthiest club on earth.
50
04/03/2021 15:20:26 199 20
bbc
Of course the 'attack' on the AZ vaccine was purely due to politics.

They did not want the UK and its efforts post Brexit and so had to rubbish our largest vaccine source.

Now they look both stupid and culpable for many EU citizens being put at risk.
225
04/03/2021 15:52:17 11 21
bbc
How do you explain Sweden, South Africa and South Korea doing exactly the same as France and Germany? AZ are part Swedish and their own government felt the Oxford trials were inadequate.
270
04/03/2021 15:58:59 6 14
bbc
No, they wanted to follow the actual science, there was not enough testing in over 65s to verify either its safety or effectiveness, the USA didn't approve it either. So France and Germany with far fewer deaths than England look silly do they.
413
04/03/2021 18:06:33 1 1
bbc
Thats right of course it was, causation does not equal to correlation.
519
05/03/2021 00:50:39 3 1
bbc
Its worse. They are throwing away unused doses whilst people in poorer parts of the wsorld can't get any. It disgusts me! Selfishness stupidity and petty politics
570
05/03/2021 14:02:37 0 1
bbc
AZ trials were on a very limited age range you can't do trials on young people with limited diversity and then say the drug is safe and proven for the very elderly and ethnic minority. especially when Africa has proven the drug was nowhere near as effective as the drug company were claiming
51
04/03/2021 15:20:55 46 4
bbc
About time too. If we had made the same crass - and deadly - misjudgment, it would be front of the news.
352
04/03/2021 16:22:30 8 14
bbc
England has killed more of its citizens than any other country.
10
04/03/2021 15:09:33 227 26
bbc
No doubt many hundreds, of not thousands of lives in Europe could have been saved had not the likes of Merkel and Macron opened their mouths and given us their uneducated thoughts.
52
04/03/2021 15:21:11 16 41
bbc
And equally, many lives could have been lost if the UK had proceeded with inefficient vaccinations! As far as health is concerned, a safe approach is always the best answer. We took a gamble and did well. Could have gone the other way round. The reason we did is that the UK had no other option considering how badly the situation was in the first place!
87
04/03/2021 15:26:19 39 9
bbc
Except this wasn't a gamble. It was on the effectiveness of the vaccine in the elderly - whether more or less effective, not if it worked or not. So it's mind-boggling that those two governments, in particular, would fob off something as "not working" or "pseudo effective" when it would have been useful, even if less effective than it is. A ridiculous decision and probably politically driven.
162
04/03/2021 15:39:54 23 3
bbc
We did not gamble at all, both the UK and the EU medicines agencies approved AZ vaccine without age restriction. The EU had no more age data than the UK yet took exactly the same decision, do you mistakenly believe the EU gambled too with AZ approval?
3
Bob
04/03/2021 15:08:00 57 10
bbc
Look a bit silly now don't you.
53
04/03/2021 15:21:30 9 77
bbc
Maybe. However, if the AstraZeneca vaccine should have long-term ill effects, who would look silly then? Would BJ look silly (or reckless), whereas France/Germany look prudent/cautious? Time will tell.
128
04/03/2021 15:32:19 10 5
bbc
Unlikely. This issue was never about safety it was about efficacy.
132
04/03/2021 15:33:14 22 5
bbc
You already look silly by coming out with such crap.
227
04/03/2021 15:52:32 9 1
bbc
The data they said was missing was about efficacy which was also missing for the Pfizer vaccine but they went with that one. I wonder why?
278
04/03/2021 16:03:24 3 1
bbc
I think you would look silly nitroxy, because you clearly don't understand what you're writing about .
44
04/03/2021 15:19:42 6 23
bbc
Absolute pathetic Daily Mail pub bore jingoism on here. An embarrassment to the nation. Shame on you and your insecurities.
54
04/03/2021 15:21:42 3 2
bbc
Then stop sending it.
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
55
04/03/2021 15:21:43 3 1
bbc
What planet are you on?
56
04/03/2021 15:21:46 18 3
bbc
Hopefully the anti-vax and misinformation spreaders in Germany are held to account like President Trump was.
11
04/03/2021 15:10:18 14 46
bbc
People wanting to make something of this. German authorities simply didn’t have enough data to approve for older folk. Now they do. Simple as that. No need for any pathetic jingoism.
57
04/03/2021 15:21:51 5 1
bbc
Politicians overruled their own regulators who deemed it safe for all ages...
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
58
04/03/2021 15:22:03 3 1
bbc
Sorry Bob that’s just bull! It was indeed a calculated risk but underpinned by sound scientific opinion both in terms of speedy approval of the vaccine and its method of deployment. Decisions taken by other European countries are for them to defend but we can be proud of what we have done in UK without crowing of course.
11
04/03/2021 15:10:18 14 46
bbc
People wanting to make something of this. German authorities simply didn’t have enough data to approve for older folk. Now they do. Simple as that. No need for any pathetic jingoism.
59
04/03/2021 15:22:04 7 3
bbc
Rubbish. The evidence was hard and there. Germany and France wanted to play the EU solidarity card and as a result thousands of people have died.
60
DJP
04/03/2021 15:22:12 29 3
bbc
Yes, and it's a huge mistake because the Oxford vaccine is the most user friendly as regards storage, cost and distribution.
33
04/03/2021 15:15:54 60 31
bbc
Tony Blair spotted an opportunity for him to jump on. Won't change the fact he was and will always be the worst PM to ever disgrace our history.
61
04/03/2021 15:22:21 7 6
bbc
Actually its a close tie with Gordon Brown.... one fiscally inept and the other spent blood in the sand on a lie.
200
04/03/2021 15:48:14 7 8
bbc
Johnson must be in the running no? His skilled handling of the pandemic has made us world beaters in killing citizens and crashing the economy. What a guy!
245
04/03/2021 15:56:08 1 4
bbc
Harold Wilson announced three days before he did it, that he was going to devalue the pound. He didn't understand economics, cost the country a fortune. Hmm, Gordon Brown, Harold Wilson, Tony Blair, they all shared the same political ideals!
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
62
04/03/2021 15:22:26 3 1
bbc
The thing is though it was never going to be a no risk strategy. You know people are going to die if they don't have a vaccine and they may be protected if they do. It's a reasonable approach based on a limited timescale and pressing need, i'm pleased the UK government took a pragmatic approach in this instance.
16
04/03/2021 15:12:18 17 12
bbc
So Germany is a sovereign nation making its own choices (for good or bad.)
63
DJL
04/03/2021 15:22:51 3 3
bbc
No. Germany is now doing as it is told. EU passed the vaccine for use in all ages but Germany chose to give only to under 65's. It is now toeing the EU line. If it were making it's own choices it would have bought it's own supply earlier
64
04/03/2021 15:22:55 21 6
bbc
Even Germany knows British is best.
65
04/03/2021 15:23:03 75 6
bbc
Strange that there doesn't seem to be a raft of headlines featuring 'U-Turn', which is what happens whenever the UK Government changes policy based on more up to date information.
320
04/03/2021 16:15:00 1 10
bbc
because they don't, they change their mind based on there now being no other option.
9
04/03/2021 15:09:26 107 15
bbc
German and French leaders now burying their heads in the sand about the third wave coming to them. The electorate will not look on them kindly.
66
04/03/2021 15:23:28 24 51
bbc
Don't be too jolly just yet... The UK typically has a 2-week delay over the continent. It may well be coming our way too. Not out of the woods yet.
114
04/03/2021 15:30:31 10 5
bbc
2-week delay? Really? I have no idea how you have arrived at that. With the exception of the second wave in France, we have always been ahead of the continent from a cases perspective.
135
04/03/2021 15:33:43 13 2
bbc
Maybe, but with nearly all the over 60’s having received one jab we are very well place to weather the storm.
136
UKG
04/03/2021 15:34:03 12 1
bbc
At the moment, the situation is reversed. The UK has had it's 3rd wave ahead of the Continent. The Continent is now seeing their UK variant cases rise to about 50% (the Uk has past it's peak). France is also seeing a rise in South African variant.
The lag, this time, is very much mainland Europe orientated.
298
04/03/2021 16:02:19 3 1
bbc
Normally you would be correct Phil. But in this case the Kent variant, which has been suppressed by lock down and our incredible vaccine roll out is heading to mainland Europe. Expect a full lockdown in France and Macrons resignation in due course.
43
04/03/2021 15:19:18 8 19
bbc
Undoubtedly, there will be smug comments. Just remember, EU27 are sovereign nations who can decide independently who they want to vaccine and when and what they consider safe. So before you smug off, also have a look at the total number of deaths and think again. This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete.
67
04/03/2021 15:23:43 14 2
bbc
Sorry but the EU started it with trying to deny vaccine to the UK that we had already paid for?
Some democracy the EU when they keep trying to Bully their neighbours!
97
04/03/2021 15:27:48 1 4
bbc
No, the EU did not deny the UK their vaccine, but was trying to make sure AstraZeneca delivered the vaccine the EU had paid for and expected the delivery to happen and that is fair enough.
68
04/03/2021 15:24:03 3 1
bbc
The fact is We HAVE working vaccines. Imagine a world without them, we would all be in a continuous cycle of lock downs.. open.. lockdown until we gained herd immunity.
We'll all do so much better in the next pandemic with the lessons learned from all the mistakes made worldwide with covid.
46
04/03/2021 15:20:02 55 10
bbc
As far as France, Germany and the EU Commission are concerned that age old adage about not being able to organise a p**s up a brewery springs to mind!
69
04/03/2021 15:24:06 12 37
bbc
Hm, I would take a long and hard look at the Brexit negotiations and then be very quiet...
95
04/03/2021 15:27:27 6 2
bbc
... while you read about EU stonewalling and intransigence. Still, they couldn't get at the UK about the AZ vax so they're whining about an air-quality spat from 2007.
223
04/03/2021 15:52:13 5 2
bbc
The EU virus fiasco, driven by political ideology and self-serving bureaucracy rather than science offers a window into why the negotiations panned out the way they did. The EU was driven by fear and spite rather than a goal of mutual benefit.
269
04/03/2021 16:01:13 3 2
bbc
Right, Britain was the problem, you know because it didn't take the EU, like, 8 years to finalise an agreement with Canada.
554
05/03/2021 11:32:40 1 1
bbc
Perhaps you should follow your own comment and go very quiet. Yes, you have every right to comment on these HYS but your perpetual inane ramblings about 'half a vaccine' are at variance with published science and the WHO's conclusions.

And why the constant childish name-calling e.g. Borinochio? It undermines your already woeful attempts at making any serious contribution or informed debate.
9
04/03/2021 15:09:26 107 15
bbc
German and French leaders now burying their heads in the sand about the third wave coming to them. The electorate will not look on them kindly.
70
04/03/2021 15:24:09 7 23
bbc
True, because those countries electorates can support whomever they truly want, and have their opinions reflected by a fair voting system. Unlike Johnson, whom the majority of the UK electorate don't look on kindly either, for his bungling of everything but the vaccine. But he can rely on a large and vocal minority who'll vote for him no matter what, translating into an unfair majority of seats.
142
04/03/2021 15:36:15 4 5
bbc
You wouldn’t have said that if Corbyn had won, as the the model applies equally to the two main parties.
175
04/03/2021 15:41:59 1 5
bbc
Yep, I remember them voting in Von Liar.
All those party-political broadcasts.
Thought the "leadership debates" on TV would never end.

Still, the people of the EU voted for Von Liar in the end.

Oh, hang on.
71
04/03/2021 15:24:10 1 2
bbc
Ve haf vays of making you laugh.......
24
DJP
04/03/2021 15:14:22 114 5
bbc
Well done Oxford and Swedish Scientists for a great vaccine.

Cheap enough for supply to the poorer countries, and our rich neighbours too.
72
04/03/2021 15:19:30 44 14
bbc
We have funded "poor" countries for years only to fund champagne dictatorships in their gated mansions whilst the people starve.
192
04/03/2021 15:44:22 2 3
bbc
yeah
grand
but the UK's also had the resources
and the kleptocratic monies
so hey
live and let live

and roll on more Brexit 'freedom' to partner with whoever, for whatever
they wish to peddle and we'll happily launder
44
04/03/2021 15:19:42 6 23
bbc
Absolute pathetic Daily Mail pub bore jingoism on here. An embarrassment to the nation. Shame on you and your insecurities.
Removed
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
74
04/03/2021 15:24:37 0 1
bbc
Data still doesn't exist to confirm that a single jab is sufficient for those who have recovered from an infection - but that hasn't stopped France, Spain and Italy adopting such a policy, purely to save doses.
Is that a reasonable view too (even though many scientists are warning against, because immunological responses to natural infection vary so much from person to person) ?
75
04/03/2021 15:24:50 3 7
bbc
I see the daily Fail brigade have finished looking at the pictures
529
05/03/2021 02:01:04 0 0
bbc
Genuinely lol
76
04/03/2021 15:24:53 26 6
bbc
The EU continues to demonstrate its intrinsic bureaucratic approach and one, which like the dinosaurs with their large bodies and small brains, will ensure its gradual demise
43
04/03/2021 15:19:18 8 19
bbc
Undoubtedly, there will be smug comments. Just remember, EU27 are sovereign nations who can decide independently who they want to vaccine and when and what they consider safe. So before you smug off, also have a look at the total number of deaths and think again. This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete.
77
04/03/2021 15:24:53 3 1
bbc
Well the smugness or Macron and Merkel has put them two months behind the UK and cost countless unnecessary deaths all in the name of anecdotal evidence.....
44
04/03/2021 15:19:42 6 23
bbc
Absolute pathetic Daily Mail pub bore jingoism on here. An embarrassment to the nation. Shame on you and your insecurities.
78
04/03/2021 15:25:01 2 1
bbc
Whilst EU states are doing precisely what they said they wouldn't do nearly 4 weeks ago.
They've set their vaccine roll-out back weeks because of petty politicking.
79
04/03/2021 15:25:13 25 5
bbc
The unimaginable stupidity of politicians across Europe bad mouthing a life saving vaccine in order to cover up their own collective ineptitude and to dump on the UK almost beggars belief. Actually what am I saying, they're politicians, of course it's believable.
80
04/03/2021 15:25:28 9 6
bbc
Germany is late to the party once again.........................................
39
04/03/2021 15:18:43 6 28
bbc
The UK took a fingers crossed approach. In some ways we were the guinea pigs. Now they've seen the evidence. From the UK that vaccine works. In the elderly age group. They have approved it. If AZ had the data for the elderly population. It would have been approved for use in this age group straight away. They were not point scoring as some would think.
81
04/03/2021 15:25:43 7 1
bbc
As far as I can tell, the mistake made by both Merkel and Macron was that they cast doubt on the efficacy of AstraZeneca. They should have simply stuck to the fact - ie that there was insufficient data to be sure that it would protect the over 65s. Casting doubt merely gave people the opportunity to claim political point scoring.
82
04/03/2021 15:25:51 1 3
bbc
What a shame the woke brigade insisted we give the vaccine away at cost price.
Largesse extremely unlikely to be taken into account when the boot is on the other foot.
Fine words butter no parsnips.
32
04/03/2021 15:15:12 26 12
bbc
Angela Merkel may be many things, but 'uneducated' is definitely not one of them.
83
04/03/2021 15:26:04 22 2
bbc
I think the point was they are not health professionals they are politicians.
211
04/03/2021 15:47:35 1 8
bbc
and nor is Borinochio.
41
04/03/2021 15:19:09 153 17
bbc
Rubbish comments everyone.

This was Merkel and Macron playing politics at the cost of European peoples lives.

Our government have made some mistakes, but nothing as criminal as this.
84
04/03/2021 15:26:13 71 22
bbc
Very true, however they run the EU just like Stalin ran the USSR! in fact the whole framework of the EU is designed on the USSR model. Thousands of people on exhobitant salaries voting but the power is with the elite at its centre
160
04/03/2021 15:39:31 6 4
bbc
Even down to calling it the bloc
276
04/03/2021 16:01:25 5 7
bbc
Yes, the USSR held regular democratic elections... oh wait you are talking utter nonsense.
455
04/03/2021 19:56:15 0 1
bbc
What a load of nonsense.
577
05/03/2021 14:20:18 0 1
bbc
EU is run as democracy which citizens elect there representatives. You couldn't more stupid if you tried
85
04/03/2021 15:26:13 4 14
bbc
Well done Ian Brown of Stone Roses for pulling out of a festival in September over vaccine passports.

Vaccination, yes. Compulsion, no.

Win the argument, win the war. Logic, not threats.
108
FF
04/03/2021 15:29:17 4 1
bbc
Ian Brown is an A$$. Great artist but a paranoid android. And just for laughs Ian Brown has taken more drugs than Sussex as a whole yet is crying about a 5mm Vaccine jab.

I Wanna Be A Door!
117
04/03/2021 15:30:59 3 1
bbc
There is no compulsion fro the un-vaccinated to attend! I trust you will support the right of those vaccinated not to have to mix with the antivaxers.
In pure business terms there is a market of 90% vaccinated and 10% unvaccinated - I wonder who will win out?
28
Bob
04/03/2021 15:14:50 9 32
bbc
Anyone crowing about EU leaders is essentially playing the role of Capt. Hindsight, and I bet most of them enjoy taking a dig at him.

They took a reasonable view. The data didn't exist, and they didn't wish to take the 'let's just try it' approach we did.

Our approach has a cost and waste risk attached. It worked out OK - but it is a hindsight view to then trash those who didn't take that path.
86
04/03/2021 15:26:14 4 1
bbc
I seem to remember that a few days before they decided not to use it, they were complaining about not being able to get enough of it. Legal action against AZ was threatened and they even threatened to close the Irish border and break the trade agreement before the ink was even dry.

You say they took a reasonable view. No, they behaviour was petty and ridiculous and will have had consequences.
52
04/03/2021 15:21:11 16 41
bbc
And equally, many lives could have been lost if the UK had proceeded with inefficient vaccinations! As far as health is concerned, a safe approach is always the best answer. We took a gamble and did well. Could have gone the other way round. The reason we did is that the UK had no other option considering how badly the situation was in the first place!
87
04/03/2021 15:26:19 39 9
bbc
Except this wasn't a gamble. It was on the effectiveness of the vaccine in the elderly - whether more or less effective, not if it worked or not. So it's mind-boggling that those two governments, in particular, would fob off something as "not working" or "pseudo effective" when it would have been useful, even if less effective than it is. A ridiculous decision and probably politically driven.
213
04/03/2021 15:49:06 2 13
bbc
It was entirely based on the science, the USA didn't approve it either. There had not been enough testing in over 65s to verify either its safety or effectiveness.
337
04/03/2021 16:24:39 0 4
bbc
You need to read something other than the UK press. The German government immediately slapped down as incompetents who did not understand the data the journalists who claimed that the AZ vaccine was ineffective. Macron said that it might have limited effectiveness in older people, but that he would rely upon scientific advice. Both countries have had roll-out problems, but that is something else.
43
04/03/2021 15:19:18 8 19
bbc
Undoubtedly, there will be smug comments. Just remember, EU27 are sovereign nations who can decide independently who they want to vaccine and when and what they consider safe. So before you smug off, also have a look at the total number of deaths and think again. This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete.
88
04/03/2021 15:22:25 2 1
bbc
Germany is only part of the EU when it suits them.
39
04/03/2021 15:18:43 6 28
bbc
The UK took a fingers crossed approach. In some ways we were the guinea pigs. Now they've seen the evidence. From the UK that vaccine works. In the elderly age group. They have approved it. If AZ had the data for the elderly population. It would have been approved for use in this age group straight away. They were not point scoring as some would think.
89
04/03/2021 15:23:12 1 2
bbc
No we took the decision cos our scientific community are the best in the world.
43
04/03/2021 15:19:18 8 19
bbc
Undoubtedly, there will be smug comments. Just remember, EU27 are sovereign nations who can decide independently who they want to vaccine and when and what they consider safe. So before you smug off, also have a look at the total number of deaths and think again. This is a terrible disease, and we should all work together rather than to compete.
90
04/03/2021 15:26:46 2 1
bbc
The EU and those sovereign states have made a mess not to be smug about, but to pity the people who haven't had a jab because of the petty politicking.
39
04/03/2021 15:18:43 6 28
bbc
The UK took a fingers crossed approach. In some ways we were the guinea pigs. Now they've seen the evidence. From the UK that vaccine works. In the elderly age group. They have approved it. If AZ had the data for the elderly population. It would have been approved for use in this age group straight away. They were not point scoring as some would think.
91
04/03/2021 15:26:57 1 3
bbc
What rubbish. The evidence was there or as much as was available for the other vaccines. The EU didn't want to accept it post Brexit. Simple as that. They played with the lives of their own citizens. Macrons comments were absolutely outrageous.
92
04/03/2021 15:26:57 2 15
bbc
So Germany could agree this whilst being in the EU - as we could have done had we still been members. The AZ vaccine was initially made in the EU before being transported to the UK. Several of those manufacturing sites were built with funds from the EU BUT still people post on here gloating about Brexit. Tell fishermen, farmers, hauliers, bankers etc etc that Bojo, Gove etc can be trusted
93
04/03/2021 15:27:07 2 5
bbc
Would prefer to comment on our own Megan/ Harry debacle rather than get all nationalistic!
Will not happen...the mods would be over-worked in 10 minutes! Removed
37
04/03/2021 15:18:37 26 4
bbc
The Germans usually recognise quality right away. I was surprised at Germany's initial response to the AZ vaccine, especially as Merkel was a scientist. Maybe she should have remained a scientist.
94
04/03/2021 15:27:24 5 4
bbc
Remained a Scientist? Or remained a Communist???
130
04/03/2021 15:32:39 2 2
bbc
Maybe, she does look like a spy.
69
04/03/2021 15:24:06 12 37
bbc
Hm, I would take a long and hard look at the Brexit negotiations and then be very quiet...
95
04/03/2021 15:27:27 6 2
bbc
... while you read about EU stonewalling and intransigence. Still, they couldn't get at the UK about the AZ vax so they're whining about an air-quality spat from 2007.
350
04/03/2021 16:21:06 1 5
bbc
yet they need us more than we need them, how can they possibly be doing anything.
96
04/03/2021 15:27:38 2 9
bbc
So they backed down under pressure, not for scientific reasons? Seems as trustworthy as Matt Hancock
67
04/03/2021 15:23:43 14 2
bbc
Sorry but the EU started it with trying to deny vaccine to the UK that we had already paid for?
Some democracy the EU when they keep trying to Bully their neighbours!
97
04/03/2021 15:27:48 1 4
bbc
No, the EU did not deny the UK their vaccine, but was trying to make sure AstraZeneca delivered the vaccine the EU had paid for and expected the delivery to happen and that is fair enough.
98
04/03/2021 15:27:48 32 5
bbc
When you put getting revenge over Brexit ahead of the lives of the people you govern. Shame on Merkel and Macron.
99
04/03/2021 15:28:00 3 6
bbc
Such a shame we left the EU.
32
04/03/2021 15:15:12 26 12
bbc
Angela Merkel may be many things, but 'uneducated' is definitely not one of them.
100
04/03/2021 15:27:15 33 7
bbc
Then there really isn't an excuse is there. It therefore boils down to EU politics playing with lives. If this was a German or French vaccine then this would never have happened.

The EU the gift that keeps on "taking".
217
04/03/2021 15:50:06 1 13
bbc
Yet there is England with the highest death rate and worst economy. Kippers the gift that keeps on giving.