Sir Keir Starmer's critics in Labour become increasingly vocal
02/03/2021 | news | politics | 2,318
The Labour leader is not being strident enough in opposition, two ex-shadow ministers say.
1
02/03/2021 10:14:23 70 14
bbc
Damned if he does, dammed if he doesn't... the lot of an opposition leader.
10
02/03/2021 10:16:53 14 30
bbc
Did he ?

Dodd he.
145
02/03/2021 10:36:30 6 1
bbc
That is the lot of any administration in power right now in this pandemic ..... I am sure he really doesn't want the current poisoned chalice and is happy to snipe from the side-lines. Ironic his own party turn on him for that.
157
02/03/2021 10:38:33 6 0
bbc
But he does dammed nothing.
449
02/03/2021 11:11:04 4 1
bbc
I think you'll find that applies to the PM equally as well!
623
02/03/2021 11:51:28 3 0
bbc
'Damned if he does, dammed if he doesn't... the lot of an opposition leader.'

and the lot of being Prime Minister too!
645
02/03/2021 11:54:32 1 4
bbc
He has to beat the right wing press owned by overseas tax evaders.
2
02/03/2021 10:14:42 253 19
bbc
We can comment on Labour's woes, but not the SNP's.
55
02/03/2021 10:24:50 193 22
bbc
Dissent is not allowed here in the queendom of Sturgeonia. Come the revolution!
Seems like we're never allowed an opportunity to comment on the Conservatives' displeasure with Bojo the Clown either. Funny that. Removed
224
02/03/2021 10:34:39 16 1
bbc
Don't be silly. That would be impartial, non-bias new reporting.
"Brexit" means Scottish Independence, Irish unification, the regional fragmentation of England and Wales, the end of the monarchy and the death of the Conservative and Unionist Party. Get over it. Removed
840
02/03/2021 12:51:55 5 8
bbc
Or indeed Boris' new Charitable Foundation to get Big Business to pay for Carrie's "Out of Control" home decorating foibles, under the guise of Supporting Britain or the Conservative Party.
Vested interests, or what?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/budget/budget-news-live-boris-johnson-brexit-b1810118.html
847
02/03/2021 12:55:00 2 1
bbc
Frankly I'm amazed that we're allowed to comment on anything critical about Labour. I had to sit down tha knows.
I am sure Sarah Smith will be permitted a party political broadcast on behalf of the Social Nationalist Party on the main news - plus the daily political broadcast by Sturgeon - blimey even Salmond complained it was not about Covid ! Removed
02/03/2021 17:29:09 1 3
bbc
Seems like we're never allowed an opportunity to comment on the Conservatives' displeasure with Bojo the Clown either. Funny that.

But to get around the other clown who had this comment removed on the grounds of being 'off-topic' I will add this; I think Kier Starmer is doing very well under the circumstances, given that 80% of the press support the Tories despite 123,000 Covid-19 deaths.
02/03/2021 17:52:02 0 4
bbc
Why would you want to? It's just another incidence of the BBC giving powerful men the benefit of the doubt because it suits the "English" aristocracy/Tories and furthers the journalistic careers of their Eton/OxBridge bag carriers.
Never liked them, but I never thought I'd see the day Tory voters became so servile that they'd cheer the UK morphing into the North Korea of the North Atlantic.
3
02/03/2021 10:14:42 8 12
bbc
Starmer's brand of Tory Lite politics will never sit well with what is supposed to be the countries left wing party.
9
02/03/2021 10:16:25 14 19
bbc
Some time in the future they will understand that they are supposed to represent the working classes
11
02/03/2021 10:16:56 5 1
bbc
And traditional Labour politics does not sit well with the rest of the country. See New Labour.
4
02/03/2021 10:15:00 353 48
bbc
The Momentum Marxists continue their march towards electoral oblivion and do their best to drag the rest of Labour down with them.

Tories are going to be happy.
68
02/03/2021 10:27:00 113 237
bbc
This country desperately needs a better opposition than any faction of the Labour Party appears to be able to provide. The Tories, or something like the Tories, will always exist to represent the mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. But forward-thinking progressives are poorly served.
92
02/03/2021 10:30:09 51 15
bbc
Upsetting the Marxists is a clear sign that he's actually appealing to the electorate and perhaps even on course to win an election.
244
02/03/2021 10:46:39 5 18
bbc
The Marxists have been leaving in droves. Keep up. Have even read the story
255
02/03/2021 10:48:11 41 7
bbc
Momentum should form their own party, out on the fringe left where they belong.
290
02/03/2021 10:43:41 11 11
bbc
If I was Sir Keir, I'd jump ship to the Conservatives. He is better suited to them anyway, he could probably fill the old Ken Clarke role.
370
Al
02/03/2021 11:02:04 14 1
bbc
But don't forget, as they still keep telling us, they won the argument....although, unfortunately, they narrowly lost the election.
I just wish I could find out what the argument they won was.
The Tories aren't going to be happy when 'the mob' rock up outside their mansions, and it'll take more than a set of sociopaths and sycophants (aka Tory voters) to stop us. Removed
927
02/03/2021 13:17:34 4 1
bbc
Do you even know what Karl Marx philosophies are? No, I thought not.

Some of Marx philosophies are undeniable truths. I am a very moderate socialist, middle of the road, what some simpletons would call a 'champagne socialist'. I am no Marxist but some of his writings are very good.

Don't be lazy, calling someone a Marxist, it is a compliment in my view, it show's we think and care.
02/03/2021 13:35:58 3 0
bbc
Do you have a problem with Tax profits from Large Corps who made vast profits from the lockdown?
02/03/2021 14:28:54 0 2
bbc
Labour’s hijacking grassroots activists didn’t listen to the voters. The voters however did listen to them and voted for Boris. That is just about the lowest point in Labour’s entire history. Don’t forget how the Scots have quite rightly rejected Labour also. The last decent leader of Labour was Harold Wilson. Blair should be in prison, Starmer is a stopgap bring back David Miliband.
5
02/03/2021 10:15:19 21 45
bbc
Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party
13
02/03/2021 10:17:33 23 31
bbc
Boris Johnson has proven to be a disaster for the country.
16
02/03/2021 10:18:12 4 15
bbc
The trouble with the opposition is that whatever the amount is, it's never enough or too much.

The Never ruddy satisfieds.
32
02/03/2021 10:21:13 6 2
bbc
It was Corbyn and his 3rd world socialism that gave Labour the worst result ever.
6
02/03/2021 10:15:51 83 25
bbc
Perhaps they should have been more critical a year ago, but as Sir Keir has often demonstrated, hindsight is a wonderful thing.
28
02/03/2021 10:20:08 65 130
bbc
Boris lies, and the gullible cult members believe him.
458
02/03/2021 11:15:08 11 0
bbc
The party of socialism sticks up a knight of the realm as leader, laughable.
7
02/03/2021 10:16:07 23 7
bbc
The Left obviously supports a Corbyn cohort as leader.
29
02/03/2021 10:20:27 26 2
bbc
But the party elected Starmer with an overwhelming majority.
8
02/03/2021 10:16:13 11 9
bbc
Don't know if its intentional or just that he's so beige as to be unnewsworthy, but I rarely hear of him. Corbyn was in the news everyday, mainly because they wanted rid of him, but at least he was in the conversation. Buck up or get out, Sir.
23
02/03/2021 10:19:32 5 21
bbc
I liked Corbyn's aura

Sir Keir's is 50 shades of greige
3
02/03/2021 10:14:42 8 12
bbc
Starmer's brand of Tory Lite politics will never sit well with what is supposed to be the countries left wing party.
9
02/03/2021 10:16:25 14 19
bbc
Some time in the future they will understand that they are supposed to represent the working classes
48
02/03/2021 10:23:23 3 0
bbc
That horse has long since bolted and the stable door slammed sht.
02/03/2021 13:46:01 0 0
bbc
How do you define the term “working classes”, which gets banded about so often, but without any qualification as to who fits into that categorisation? Is it just anyone who is dependant upon the Public Purse for an income or is there some magical salary threshold that enables someone to be labelled working class or maybe even anyone foolish enough to support the Labour Party?
03/03/2021 00:06:05 0 0
bbc
You should talk to your kids more
Most of working age are curiously moderate
They have to be because they have no employee protections and Maggie disembowelled the unions, so they need to keep their jobs
It is only the oldies that refight the 1970s and pigeonhole themselves as "working class", or "middle class" and rip the country apart on the back of it
1
02/03/2021 10:14:23 70 14
bbc
Damned if he does, dammed if he doesn't... the lot of an opposition leader.
10
02/03/2021 10:16:53 14 30
bbc
Did he ?

Dodd he.
592
02/03/2021 11:44:06 0 0
bbc
That's a knotty issue.
3
02/03/2021 10:14:42 8 12
bbc
Starmer's brand of Tory Lite politics will never sit well with what is supposed to be the countries left wing party.
11
02/03/2021 10:16:56 5 1
bbc
And traditional Labour politics does not sit well with the rest of the country. See New Labour.
12
02/03/2021 10:17:12 15 13
bbc
Bring back Jezza. We could all do with a laugh !
20
02/03/2021 10:18:37 19 1
bbc
Don't. We need a credible opposition for a healthy democracy.
24
02/03/2021 10:19:43 1 1
bbc
A laugh that we will pay very dearly though.
31
02/03/2021 10:20:55 0 1
bbc
My hope was for Jess Phillips
5
02/03/2021 10:15:19 21 45
bbc
Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party
13
02/03/2021 10:17:33 23 31
bbc
Boris Johnson has proven to be a disaster for the country.
69
02/03/2021 10:27:10 1 2
bbc
He has, but that doesn't negate the original point that Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party.

Two wrong's don't make a right. And Boris being even more of a disaster doesn't mean Sir Keir is any less of one - he just looks it in perspective.
14
02/03/2021 10:17:43 16 15
bbc
If you want to raise tax. Close the tax havens. Oh forgot most Ministers have off shore accounts.
15
02/03/2021 10:18:02 103 29
bbc
IMO I think he is a credible opposition to the Tories, who I usually vote for.

I am listening very carefully to what he and other parties are saying. We need to have a real choice when the next elections come up. Not just that of who seems the least worst option!
76
02/03/2021 10:27:50 80 3
bbc
Interesting comment in that I have had to vote for the least worst option for the last 15 years or more. If only there were a party that put common sense ahead of politics and political correctness.
105
jon
02/03/2021 10:31:53 14 4
bbc
Agreed but Starmer has no personality. It’s all well and good appealing to the Islington set who have kept their public sector posts and pensions but how can he ever appeal to the red wall working class voters who are losing their jobs?
222
02/03/2021 10:44:28 0 0
bbc
This ^^^
256
02/03/2021 10:48:17 9 0
bbc
Welcome to politics, it's always a case of the least worst option. If people are looking for perfection then they are going to be sadly disappointed. Socialism is an abject failure and always will be but not to be confused with social responsibility.
358
02/03/2021 11:00:48 3 1
bbc
Maybe there should be a 'vote of no confidence' option on the ballot and that results in a clear out of all the incompetent clowns in each party. Then maybe we will start to get close to a political system that actually works for people.
02/03/2021 16:20:02 1 2
bbc
You prove that what he is completely out of line with what labour should be.

We need to stop appealing to the right, or we only ever get options on the right. Your vote, as a tory voter - really isn't something labour should be trying for, at all - Why pick up one of you, who MAY vote for starman, and not labours supporters on the left, who treated right, WILL vote for labour?
5
02/03/2021 10:15:19 21 45
bbc
Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party
16
02/03/2021 10:18:12 4 15
bbc
The trouble with the opposition is that whatever the amount is, it's never enough or too much.

The Never ruddy satisfieds.
17
rob
02/03/2021 10:15:59 17 13
bbc
a party in severe decline greens will be the main opposition within 20 years if they insist on being run by the unions
153
02/03/2021 10:38:08 5 3
bbc
Starmer is a charisma-free zone; a useless fence-sitter; a stuffed shirt bureaucrat.

Labour lurch from one loser to the next. Small wonder they suffered their worst defeat for 90 years at the last General Election and have remained out of power for 20 years.

Left wing politics are dead. Socialism has failed miserably wherever it's been tried, because it simply doesn't work as a methodology.
18
02/03/2021 10:16:40 81 35
bbc
Is there anybody in the Country who is in the least bit interested in what the failed Labour Party say or do?

Thanks Jeremy Corbyn "peacemaker in Ireland" LOL
52
02/03/2021 10:23:59 44 6
bbc
Yes, in so far as the Labour Party under Corbyn made the current woeful excuse for a government the best option. We need a credible opposition....whoever that turns out to be.
58
02/03/2021 10:24:59 5 8
bbc
Yes, sick of Boris and his lies.
02/03/2021 15:35:45 0 1
bbc
Corbyn's sympathies with such as Irish republicans, Chagos Islanders, Kurds, Palestinians, Iranians, etc, and his hostility to NATO, IMF, the EU, White House, House of Saud, Knesset, etc, placed him firmly outside of neo-liberal/colonialist consensus, and, yes, he was a genuine threat to these warmongers' idea of national "security". In 2017, with Brexit settled 40% of voters sided with Corbyn.
19
02/03/2021 10:17:24 11 11
bbc
Well he is Blair Mark II but without any of the charisma....
26
02/03/2021 10:19:58 2 15
bbc
Which Blair's project?
36
02/03/2021 10:21:42 1 0
bbc
If by "charisma" you mean contempt for the electorate, lying, self-serving behaviour, then I suggest that they are, in fact, pretty similar.
12
02/03/2021 10:17:12 15 13
bbc
Bring back Jezza. We could all do with a laugh !
20
02/03/2021 10:18:37 19 1
bbc
Don't. We need a credible opposition for a healthy democracy.
21
02/03/2021 10:18:52 19 14
bbc
He's the Steve interesting Davis of politics. No charisma, no drive. Tories are delighted
41
02/03/2021 10:22:38 5 19
bbc
Tories are deluded.
162
02/03/2021 10:39:07 2 0
bbc
Harsh!

(On Steve Davis)
22
02/03/2021 10:18:59 203 26
bbc
Are those critics the same people who called us to "support the leader" when the leader was Corbyn? Hypocrites indeed!

The party has elected Starmer with an overwhelming majority. The people are sick of Corbyn and his 3rd world socialism; they want real policies for the real world.
And the reason we have Johnson & Co is exactly Corbyn and the lunatics who chant his name like they see the messiah.
164
02/03/2021 10:39:22 29 147
bbc
You dont do irony do you?
The whole point is that Starmer was a part of the right wing coup that betrayed Corbyn and the members -- yet now you want people to support him when he conspired to lose Labour an election -- strange fellow
238
02/03/2021 10:46:04 26 11
bbc
The problem for Labour (well, one of many) is that they've replaced Corbyn's 'third world socialism' for wokeism, another deeply unpopular, cult-like mantra that's similarly far removed from the British psyche.

They've had their chips, basically.
268
02/03/2021 10:49:59 26 2
bbc
The trouble is that the "overwhelming majority" of the party are now Momentum. The core membership have left in droves. I am one of them.
269
02/03/2021 10:50:12 5 21
bbc
Project fear told us that Labour would spend a load of money.

Now the tories have splurged loads of money, knocking down forests of magic money trees and everything is alright.

Johnson has been implementing socialist policies over the last year and will continue to do so
02/03/2021 18:01:23 1 1
bbc
Starmer isnt up to it though is he. You can define 'it' as you like.
02/03/2021 18:52:18 0 2
bbc
Shame Starmer is such a weak , boring, person with a high pitched voice. Not really leader qualities.
03/03/2021 15:45:40 0 0
bbc
Starmer was elected on a promise to increase corporation tax. A policy that is almost universally popular with the electorate. You don't know what you're talking about.
8
02/03/2021 10:16:13 11 9
bbc
Don't know if its intentional or just that he's so beige as to be unnewsworthy, but I rarely hear of him. Corbyn was in the news everyday, mainly because they wanted rid of him, but at least he was in the conversation. Buck up or get out, Sir.
23
02/03/2021 10:19:32 5 21
bbc
I liked Corbyn's aura

Sir Keir's is 50 shades of greige
12
02/03/2021 10:17:12 15 13
bbc
Bring back Jezza. We could all do with a laugh !
24
02/03/2021 10:19:43 1 1
bbc
A laugh that we will pay very dearly though.
25
02/03/2021 10:19:51 34 7
bbc
Throughout history it seems people want flamboyant charismatic leaders. Unfortunately they often prove to be nasty corrupt villains
159
02/03/2021 10:38:38 7 17
bbc
"All politicians ever".
19
02/03/2021 10:17:24 11 11
bbc
Well he is Blair Mark II but without any of the charisma....
26
02/03/2021 10:19:58 2 15
bbc
Which Blair's project?
27
02/03/2021 10:20:02 176 28
bbc
Nevermind the looney lefty activists, how about listening to the people? Labour have learnt nothing.
185
02/03/2021 10:41:23 153 30
bbc
Trouble is, Corbyn opened the floodgates to the looney lefty fringe and now their membership is irrevocably infested.

Labour is nothing more than an irrelevant protest group, best ignored.
204
02/03/2021 10:42:44 6 23
bbc
Not listening to the people has never done the Tories any harm.

What Labour needs to learn is how to get the likes of Murdoch et al onside and do propaganda on their behalf.
237
02/03/2021 10:45:58 9 6
bbc
I think you are being disingenuous to the Labour party, I believe Keir and his team are trying to listen to the people.

This is just few people he sacked trying to spoil things out of spite.
262
02/03/2021 10:48:50 8 12
bbc
The far left don’t feel at home under centrist Starmer.

The tories have purged any centrists and now only represent the fringe of society, because they have been stealing UKIP policies.

So starmer being centrist or slightly left of centre feels far left as the tories have gone full blown populist
550
02/03/2021 11:38:05 1 12
bbc
Problem you have is that tabloid indoctrinated boomer babies aren't going to be the most influential demographic in elections for much longer, and Gens X, Y and Z are already overwhelmingly anti-Tory.
6
02/03/2021 10:15:51 83 25
bbc
Perhaps they should have been more critical a year ago, but as Sir Keir has often demonstrated, hindsight is a wonderful thing.
28
02/03/2021 10:20:08 65 130
bbc
Boris lies, and the gullible cult members believe him.
46
CJR
02/03/2021 10:23:09 32 3
bbc
Wow this hys is about labour and yet you bring up boris, he must be living rent free in your head ??????
139
02/03/2021 10:36:00 15 3
bbc
But do they, though? Or is it the case that they accept him and his lies and idiocy as a better option than anything Labour?
638
02/03/2021 11:53:20 2 4
bbc
And who said the Tory Party is like a religious cult. Rachel Johnson. Leeching of the gullible. Ask shell fishermen.
02/03/2021 15:18:23 4 2
bbc
The gullible say he lies but the the honest know that he does not which is why we vote for him.
02/03/2021 16:09:27 0 1
bbc
...and still are. E.g. over vaccine approval and procurement, which we did while in transition. Everything they do is half truths, smoke and mirrors. I despise the Tories for what they have done in the last 10 years and under Thatcher. Labour will never get my vote while they remain so incompetent and Lib Dems won't get it as they have failed so badly since Kennedy.
02/03/2021 17:18:03 1 0
bbc
It's not so much that they believe him, I think. It's more like they don't care. I think it's gone beyond truth or lies or competence when they judge him. Fandom's part of it, of course, and he knows which buttons to press. I also think he's enough of a blank canvas for people to project what they'd like him to think onto him and persuade themselves he actually thinks it.

It's interesting.
7
02/03/2021 10:16:07 23 7
bbc
The Left obviously supports a Corbyn cohort as leader.
29
02/03/2021 10:20:27 26 2
bbc
But the party elected Starmer with an overwhelming majority.
437
02/03/2021 11:11:37 4 0
bbc
Yes. Much of the Labour Left voted for him due to ten pledges he made.

The *very first* of those pledges included a commitment to "reverse the Tories’ cuts in corporation tax". The Tories have now decided it's the right time to do this themselves - and Starmer is opposing it.

Whatever you think of him, Corbyn or Labour's policies, that's obviously not a good look for a politician seeking trust.
932
02/03/2021 13:19:19 1 1
bbc
Kieth lied to win that 'overwhelming majority' though.
30
02/03/2021 10:20:44 230 22
bbc
If Momentum is unhappy then he's doing the right thing to make Labour electable. The only Labour leader to get Labour in power in the last 40 years has ignored the far left of the party.
144
02/03/2021 10:36:26 89 8
bbc
It will be 50 years by the next general election. Since the party was formed only 3 Labour leaders have EVER won a majority.
544
02/03/2021 11:36:35 0 12
bbc
You spelled 'crawled so far up Murdoch's jacksie he became a Godfather and a war criminal' wrong.
843
02/03/2021 12:53:23 1 9
bbc
Yes but Blair led a Tory Lite Govt. We will go nowhere with Starmer or Dodds. We need to show a much stronger faith in Marxism !
02/03/2021 13:52:14 6 3
bbc
And yet they still managed to reduce our living standards, pump up house prices, saddle us with obscene amounts of debt, hollow out the meaning of university, literally double the cost of the NHS to the taxpayer without actually improving it etc.

It's always a fun time at the start when it comes to socialists but once we saw enough of what they were doing to us long term it was good riddance.
Bob
02/03/2021 17:38:22 0 0
bbc
Except he is more popular with Lib Dem voters than Labour voters!

https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1361284079891722242
02/03/2021 18:00:05 0 0
bbc
He was part of the Corbyn dynasty. He is one of them.
12
02/03/2021 10:17:12 15 13
bbc
Bring back Jezza. We could all do with a laugh !
31
02/03/2021 10:20:55 0 1
bbc
My hope was for Jess Phillips
5
02/03/2021 10:15:19 21 45
bbc
Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party
32
02/03/2021 10:21:13 6 2
bbc
It was Corbyn and his 3rd world socialism that gave Labour the worst result ever.
45
02/03/2021 10:23:08 2 19
bbc
That was the electorate's fault though, Corbyn was being true to Labour ideology.
33
02/03/2021 10:21:24 64 17
bbc
Its fairly obvious that Labour still has many supporters of the Corbyn era. The problem for them is that they still haven't worked out the majority of the British electorate didn't and do not share their views.
Starmer is not inspirational for any faction - that requires charisma. He promised to sort out their anti Semitism problems, but has he? That's all gone very quiet lately.
304
02/03/2021 10:53:23 16 38
bbc
Meanwhile islamophobia is rife in the right and no one seems to mind.

The anti Semism story went quite because the MSM haven’t anything to back it up with
346
02/03/2021 10:58:40 4 18
bbc
It's all gone quiet because it doesn't exist! It was only ever a stick to beat Corbyn. It was never a wide spread problem in Labour.

Still waiting for ONE example of this so called anti Semitism
02/03/2021 14:35:28 8 0
bbc
The Labour party's own investigation decided there was anti-semitism. I see we are into the left airbrushing history again
03/03/2021 11:41:11 0 1
bbc
40% in 2017, mate, with over 60% of under 40's voting for 'hard left' Corbyn, despite a concerted media effort to portray him as a threat to national security (which he was to 'them', given his sympathies, as am I). Would have been at least the same in 2019 if not for Sir Bossy Cop's 2nd ref con. The brainwashed boomer babies won't be around forever. The future is ours.
34
02/03/2021 10:21:25 68 7
bbc
When will the Labour Party rank and file learn when to keep quiet and allow a leader to settle in without the usual internal bickering and carping? If the membership truly wants to return to government it must unite behind its leadership and show itself to be worthy of election and mature enough to be trusted with government - which it isn't at present.
02/03/2021 16:58:33 2 11
bbc
Do we really want a return to government under a leader like starmer who doesn't provide an alternative? I'd say not, better just allow it all to get worse under tories until people WAKE UP.
35
02/03/2021 10:21:34 3 5
bbc
whatever Bradshaw says (who he?), KS is much of a loser as Ed was. #RecallConference asap last chance to ditch the entire muppet sh. cabinet before locals,Scots,etc. election disaster
73
02/03/2021 10:26:45 1 0
bbc
And replace with whom??
19
02/03/2021 10:17:24 11 11
bbc
Well he is Blair Mark II but without any of the charisma....
36
02/03/2021 10:21:42 1 0
bbc
If by "charisma" you mean contempt for the electorate, lying, self-serving behaviour, then I suggest that they are, in fact, pretty similar.
67
02/03/2021 10:25:54 2 1
bbc
Oh dear, I guess you need an explanation, By "charisma", I mean Blair was engaging and persuasive, albeit completely full of it. Starmer is also full of it but has the personality of a crayon.
37
02/03/2021 10:21:48 132 15
bbc
It would have been surprising if supporters of Corbyn's brand of Labour hadn't felt miffed when a new leader came in and changed direction.

If anything it's a good sign that left wingers in Labour are unhappy with Keir Starmer's policies. He can and will purge these lunatics from the party, if he fails, so will Labour at the next GE.
389
02/03/2021 11:05:08 28 58
bbc
The Labour Party that gave us the NHS should do one final thing for this country: run on a platform of replacing FPTP with a fair system in which everyone's votes matter, then split up. Then we'd have coalition governments, representing majorities, instead of near-perpetual rule by Tories serving a large minority of reactionaries, occasionally interrupted when Labour's Tory-lite wing gains power.
02/03/2021 14:53:51 2 7
bbc
"If anything it's a good sign that left wingers in Labour are unhappy"

Yes why should there be left wingers in the supposedly left wing party.

Telling about British ideas and how we have been told to think. If you were (and I have) to show Corbyn to your average person living in a Nordic country, they describe him as "Dull centre left Grandpa".

Here? ComiMarxiStalin wants to steal your money...
38
02/03/2021 10:22:20 24 7
bbc
Apparently he isn’t even a real Vegan. Shameful.
56
02/03/2021 10:24:53 3 2
bbc
Define "real vegan".
39
02/03/2021 10:17:42 14 9
bbc
Sir Keir who is he? Mr anonymous, should be holding government to account but too busy contemplating his navel and worrying about the remaining members of Corbyn’s barmy army.
40
02/03/2021 10:19:24 23 15
bbc
WHO cares?????
86
02/03/2021 10:29:23 23 1
bbc
Everyone should. We need a effective opposition, we need choice between good parties!

At voting time I don't want it to be exercise in who I least despise!
95
02/03/2021 10:30:39 1 0
bbc
You enough to comment?
21
02/03/2021 10:18:52 19 14
bbc
He's the Steve interesting Davis of politics. No charisma, no drive. Tories are delighted
41
02/03/2021 10:22:38 5 19
bbc
Tories are deluded.
118
02/03/2021 10:33:35 4 1
bbc
Yet have won the last four general elections.
180
02/03/2021 10:41:07 3 0
bbc
But they are in power. Oh and Davis won six world titles.
218
02/03/2021 10:34:05 3 0
bbc
How so O wise one?
42
02/03/2021 10:22:51 17 13
bbc
Labour only offer fence sitting or hindsight.
43
02/03/2021 10:22:55 12 6
bbc
The elephant in the room is political parties. It's moronic to vote for a colour or flag. It's unfair our voting system does not allow change and hasn't since the 1900s.
70
02/03/2021 10:27:24 6 7
bbc
The voting system we have was established by the likes of our current government to preserve power for the priveleliged. Of course they don’t want to change it.
72
02/03/2021 10:27:42 4 1
bbc
Apart from the referendum held in 2011 regarding proportional representation ??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_United_Kingdom_Alternative_Vote_referendum
80
02/03/2021 10:28:51 7 1
bbc
We had a referendum on changing the voting system in 2011 when the LibDems were in the coalition government - we voted to keep it as it is
301
02/03/2021 10:53:13 1 0
bbc
Therein lies the problem. This two party system is strangling the UK because it never offers the BEST solution, it merely offers political dogma of one description or another. The result is that we rarely get the best solution for whatever problem may face the country. Most people are either indoctrinated into voting a particular way or vote for the least worst option in their view.
02/03/2021 17:51:25 0 0
bbc
Everyones a moron but me.
44
02/03/2021 10:23:05 16 7
bbc
Starmer was the wrong man to win back the red wall Mr 2nd Referendum was always going to struggle.

Labour have a increasingly hard time reuniting their as the Metropolitans and young graduates increasing despise Traditional working class people.

Good luck we need a effective opposition and Labour libdems greens etc are rapidly alienating too many ordinary people.
228
02/03/2021 10:44:53 1 5
bbc
No, we don't despise our tabloid-indoctrinated grandparents- even though they benefitted immeasurably from post-war socialist policies and "Greed is Good" idiotology before pulling the social mobility ladder up on their kids and grandkids, forcing us to leave our hometowns to earn our poverty in the city. We just hope they pass peacefully, and quickly so we can undo all the damage they've done.
528
02/03/2021 11:33:05 1 0
bbc
Many of these graduates are "working class" people who see through the flat caps and whippets Labour party view from the Islington elite. Parachuting a chosen by HQ candidate into "working class" areas because the locals were too thick in the opinion of party HQ hardly helps.
32
02/03/2021 10:21:13 6 2
bbc
It was Corbyn and his 3rd world socialism that gave Labour the worst result ever.
45
02/03/2021 10:23:08 2 19
bbc
That was the electorate's fault though, Corbyn was being true to Labour ideology.
555
02/03/2021 11:27:12 1 0
bbc
Wow, what a hell of a leap, IT'S THE ELECTORATES FAULT!!! Just because the electorate didn't agree with, or want, Labour ideology we are at fault, lol, you couldn't make it up. You sir have just expressed your absolute contempt for we, the general public, or electorate!!!
28
02/03/2021 10:20:08 65 130
bbc
Boris lies, and the gullible cult members believe him.
46
CJR
02/03/2021 10:23:09 32 3
bbc
Wow this hys is about labour and yet you bring up boris, he must be living rent free in your head ??????
452
02/03/2021 11:13:50 1 9
bbc
It was a reply, wake up!
47
02/03/2021 10:23:15 13 9
bbc
Starmer speaks to the public like he is a lawyer presenting a case in court.

You aint going to gee up your core voters with such an approach.

But then Starmer isn't really Labour is he. Just a toned down Blairite.
77
02/03/2021 10:28:02 3 0
bbc
Indeed. The likes of you need a charlatan who talks nice ssit. You know, Corbyn, Johnson, Farage... That will get your vote.
82
02/03/2021 10:28:53 1 0
bbc
That the "Tory Blair" Labour voters placed into No 10?
Own it.
191
02/03/2021 10:41:43 1 0
bbc
The biggest division in the Conservative Party has always been Europe. And that's over.
9
02/03/2021 10:16:25 14 19
bbc
Some time in the future they will understand that they are supposed to represent the working classes
48
02/03/2021 10:23:23 3 0
bbc
That horse has long since bolted and the stable door slammed sht.
49
02/03/2021 10:23:41 2 4
bbc
Shows how irrelevant the PLP are, Openselection is deeply needed to make the PLP truely representative of the membership and public at large and not some Neo Lib fantasy bubble
502
02/03/2021 11:25:05 0 0
bbc
What has the public at large to do with it? Labours problem is the party membership doesn't represent the public, as you would expect. Their chosen policies don't represent the policies people support. You can't change people's view of the world to suit yours.
50
02/03/2021 10:23:47 58 35
bbc
Somebody should tell him Socialism is rejected.
59
02/03/2021 10:25:10 12 21
bbc
Not telling him is just too cruel
75
02/03/2021 10:27:05 11 4
bbc
That's not true. Labour's brand of UK socialism is rejected. There's plenty of 'socialist' policy already in place - like the NHS for example.
187
02/03/2021 10:41:33 6 10
bbc
Only by the tabloid indoctrinated boomer babies who benefitted from the post-war socialist policies of Britain's most successful government.
51
02/03/2021 10:23:54 78 30
bbc
Re : Moistness

"Nevermind the looney lefty activists, how about listening to the people ?"

Funny how when politicians do badly it's never because the people don't want what they're peddling isn't it ?

Their answer is always 'we didn't get our message across'.

Labour ... hatred of the working class and no policies at all.
315
02/03/2021 10:54:59 30 41
bbc
The tories are making people poorer and their mates richer. Why are so many Tory others using food banks? Why are so many working class white kids struggljng at school? It’s been a Tory government for years and things keep getting worse.

It’s almost like it’s the tories fault
02/03/2021 15:48:26 3 0
bbc
They want everyone to wear caps and overalls, the people dont care what the bloke or woman earns up the road its what he can earn to feed his family. Socilism is the biggest poison, the person who works for themselves will try and pay the least tax and NI he can.
03/03/2021 00:01:23 1 2
bbc
"Labour ... hatred of the working class and no policies at all."

... but the Tories don't? JRM, IDS.... LOL.
If you believe that then you have really swallowed the con, hook, line and sinker. The Tories have really pulled a fast one on this country. They must be laughing into their champagne glasses.
18
02/03/2021 10:16:40 81 35
bbc
Is there anybody in the Country who is in the least bit interested in what the failed Labour Party say or do?

Thanks Jeremy Corbyn "peacemaker in Ireland" LOL
52
02/03/2021 10:23:59 44 6
bbc
Yes, in so far as the Labour Party under Corbyn made the current woeful excuse for a government the best option. We need a credible opposition....whoever that turns out to be.
53
02/03/2021 10:24:07 14 5
bbc
The most telling thing is, he's been in the job for a year, but I'd have guessed 2 months, for all that I can remember he's had to say on anything. Disappointing, whether you are pro Labour or not. Every country needs a vocal opposition party to keep the government on its toes.
176
02/03/2021 10:40:29 3 14
bbc
Contrary to popular tabloid-indoctrinated boomer-baby belief, the UK is not a democracy and maintains a controlled opposition in order to create the illusion of choice. 2015-20 was an aberration. The 'LibLabCon cabal' is restored, and once again it doesn't matter who you vote for, the friends of Jimmy Savile and Jeff Epstein win.
54
02/03/2021 10:24:26 56 9
bbc
'Grassroots activists' - worked out so well for them under Corbyn.
130
02/03/2021 10:34:57 24 54
bbc
They did enough to scare the pants of 'the establishment' and have all the names on Epstein's guest list run a relentless smear campaign for 4.5 years. If the Tories were subject to a fraction of the media scrutiny they doled out to "Corbynistas" they'd have fewer MPs than the Lib Dems. If they were held to the same standard as Corbyn, McDonnell or Abbott they'd be a proscribed organisation.
2
02/03/2021 10:14:42 253 19
bbc
We can comment on Labour's woes, but not the SNP's.
55
02/03/2021 10:24:50 193 22
bbc
Dissent is not allowed here in the queendom of Sturgeonia. Come the revolution!
211
02/03/2021 10:43:43 14 0
bbc
I think you'll find that's queefdom
785
02/03/2021 12:33:41 15 1
bbc
Nor is there ever ANYTHING on BBC about why Starmer and Labour have done NOTHING about the independent report that said Labour is institutionally anti-semitic.Perhaps that IS something Starmer and Momentum do agree on,they seem to be diametrically opposed as far as economic/tax policies are concerned. But,what do you expect from the extreme Left,which has never been in favour of democracy.
02/03/2021 16:19:23 0 0
bbc
Scotland has proportional representation. If the SNP gets a majority in Holyrood, it will be because a majority voted for them, which is more than can be said for the current Westminster government...43% ? With current polling, SNP would get over 90% of Holyrood seats with First Past the Post, like they have for Scottish seats at WM. FPtP is a double edge sword it seems.
38
02/03/2021 10:22:20 24 7
bbc
Apparently he isn’t even a real Vegan. Shameful.
56
02/03/2021 10:24:53 3 2
bbc
Define "real vegan".
430
02/03/2021 11:10:52 0 0
bbc
I asked that question of a vegan once and was told, 'If it had a Mummy or Daddy I don't eat it, wear it or use it'. (Owned a lovely vintage car - full leather seating).
57
02/03/2021 10:24:54 59 19
bbc
Labour WILL win the next general election, if, and only if, we totally eradicate the far left Corbynista Communists.
140
02/03/2021 10:36:00 21 44
bbc
That’s it, keep sucking up that pile of establishment propaganda ??
814
02/03/2021 12:41:21 0 7
bbc
Would dearly love to see a sycophant like you try to eradicate me.
863
02/03/2021 12:40:48 7 0
bbc
Not if it's then replaced by even more wokeist, Identitarian nonsense & pandering to the demands of shouty minorities, which is where it's heading.
02/03/2021 15:42:47 1 4
bbc
Labour CAN'T win a GE, not under any circumstance, primarily because the 'Progress/PeoplesVote/BetterTogether' wing lost Scotland in 2014/5, the Red Wall in 2019 and *then* decided that an English Unionist and "Remoaner Lefty human rights lawyer" was the ideal candidate to win them back, but also; boundary changes.
02/03/2021 17:57:56 2 0
bbc
No, they really won't.
18
02/03/2021 10:16:40 81 35
bbc
Is there anybody in the Country who is in the least bit interested in what the failed Labour Party say or do?

Thanks Jeremy Corbyn "peacemaker in Ireland" LOL
58
02/03/2021 10:24:59 5 8
bbc
Yes, sick of Boris and his lies.
50
02/03/2021 10:23:47 58 35
bbc
Somebody should tell him Socialism is rejected.
59
02/03/2021 10:25:10 12 21
bbc
Not telling him is just too cruel
60
02/03/2021 10:26:11 7 6
bbc
Starmer frustrates me because he isn't calling out the damage and chaos of Brexit in order to win back the Red Wall when really he should just be very honest and blunt about it all.

But criticising him for not calling for tax rises before we're even out of the pandemic is madness.
96
02/03/2021 10:30:56 5 1
bbc
If Starmer tries to turn against Brexit, like the Lib Dems did, he will lose even more working class voters. He needs to embrace Brexit to make progress in the next election, because Brexit is going to be a great success. There is no 'chaos'.
249
02/03/2021 10:37:38 0 0
bbc
"chaos of Brexit"?? What chaos is that then? The "chaos" that's failed to materialise even in a global pandemic??
I live in Kent and went down the M20 for the first time in ages last week., Mile after mile of contra-flow with half the motorway cordoned off for operation Brock (the truck park Kent was supposed to have become) All completely empty!! Even though haulage traffic is 95% of normal
61
02/03/2021 10:26:22 9 16
bbc
The Pontification Party
177
02/03/2021 10:40:37 2 14
bbc
Politics of Envy Party
62
02/03/2021 10:26:26 20 12
bbc
Corbyn had his chance and failed, so his supporters need to get behind Starmer.

We need a decent opposition to hold Johnson and his cronies to account, infighting within the Opposition will not do that.
99
02/03/2021 10:31:09 4 19
bbc
First there's the need to big up Starmer without insulting the Tories, though

Unlucky
120
02/03/2021 10:33:44 0 2
bbc
Corbyn was failed by Starmer and his ilk. Most on Labour’s front bench have been rewarded for their disloyalty to Corbyn, their twice, democratically elected leader
138
02/03/2021 10:35:46 0 2
bbc
It's what Corbyn stands for that's important. Many voted for Starmer on his 10 pledges. Don't know of many he looks like following through with. The insidious purging of left of centre party members is Orwellian. If the 'infighting' against the left of centre Corbyn policies hadn't worked so hard against Corbyn we'd already have a Labour government. Why isn't labour ahead in polls?
63
02/03/2021 10:26:32 3 6
bbc
While Boris continues to push his pie in the sky nonsense for his Fairyland projects, Keir would do better by checking the many cases of wasteful use of billions by this Government,and by not backing them over Corporation Tax.
418
02/03/2021 11:08:24 0 0
bbc
If tories increase Corporation tax it's what Labour wanted. If it's decreased it looks like the Government supports hard hit industry. Not a useful ploy. Difficult to attack a government wasting billions in a pandemic considering the billions Labour proposed wasting last election, free bees for all?
64
02/03/2021 10:26:52 9 8
bbc
I've voted Labour all my life, I've never been so disheartened by what I'm seeing and hearing from the Labour Party. It's actually sickens me to watch Starmer and his cronies compromising their own principles trying to appeal to middle class voters, most of whom just don't get true Labour values and will only vote for the party who they think will line their pockets with the most money. Sigh.
135
02/03/2021 10:35:31 1 0
bbc
I've never voted labour. Ever. Keir Starmer might however persuade me otherwise... and aren't I. a right centrist floating voter precisely the sort of person tat Labour needs to appeal to if it's to actually win an election??.
158
02/03/2021 10:38:35 0 1
bbc
I understand what you say, but are these people middle class or do they just consider themselves middle class. The reality is that most voting is based on class.....or at least on what class we consider ourselves to be.
217
02/03/2021 10:33:30 1 0
bbc
Would that be the "middle class" red wall in the North they are trying to win back??
I think you'll find Corbyn never had any problem appealing to wealthy middle class Guardian readers.
371
02/03/2021 11:02:09 0 0
bbc
You live in a past where clogs, shawls, whippets, pidgeons and cloth caps meant working class. Trilbies, bowlers, briefcase and brolly the middle class. Very Two Ronnies or 1922. The workers expect to have a chance to aspire to more than a council semi, walk to't pit and footy and fags on Saturday.
True Labour values are of the past, the "activists" dream of best forgotten dream of last century.
65
02/03/2021 10:25:42 8 10
bbc
Let's tell it as it is. Starmer is just another Tony Blair: a self-serving Champaign socialist.

The lockdowns in this country have been disproportionately crucifying the poorest: the very people Starmer should care for. But he has staunchly supported lockdowns and even wanted them made tougher. His only reason for doing this is to give Boris enough rope to hang himself with come the next election
125
02/03/2021 10:34:22 1 1
bbc
Boris is PM, why the pathetic deflection attempt?
137
02/03/2021 10:32:01 1 1
bbc
"disproportionately crucifying the poorest" (Hyperbole, much??) If lockdowns aren't strong enough, everyone starts howling that Covid is disproportionately killing the poor.
295
02/03/2021 10:51:35 0 0
bbc
Insert Corbyn instead of Blair, equally true.
Would no lockdowns have been any better for anyone? Pretty muddled thinking.
66
02/03/2021 10:25:42 40 6
bbc
Not listening to the grassroots activists is a GOOD THING. Remember what happened when the "grassroots activists" took over?
Listen to the "grassroots activists" if you want to be in opposition for ever.
02/03/2021 17:55:30 9 2
bbc
Labour is unelectable under Starmer, because Brexit supporters remember his betrayal of the Referendum vote. Corbyn went from hero in 2017 to zero in 2019 on the back of his repudiation of democracy.
36
02/03/2021 10:21:42 1 0
bbc
If by "charisma" you mean contempt for the electorate, lying, self-serving behaviour, then I suggest that they are, in fact, pretty similar.
67
02/03/2021 10:25:54 2 1
bbc
Oh dear, I guess you need an explanation, By "charisma", I mean Blair was engaging and persuasive, albeit completely full of it. Starmer is also full of it but has the personality of a crayon.
90
02/03/2021 10:30:01 1 0
bbc
I actually have seen crayons with more charisma. And more political ability. :)
4
02/03/2021 10:15:00 353 48
bbc
The Momentum Marxists continue their march towards electoral oblivion and do their best to drag the rest of Labour down with them.

Tories are going to be happy.
68
02/03/2021 10:27:00 113 237
bbc
This country desperately needs a better opposition than any faction of the Labour Party appears to be able to provide. The Tories, or something like the Tories, will always exist to represent the mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. But forward-thinking progressives are poorly served.
93
ant
02/03/2021 10:30:20 79 38
bbc
"mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. " ....you mean those with common sense!
166
02/03/2021 10:39:58 35 33
bbc
Agreed. I just wish the Momentum lot would go back to the SWP where they all came from in the first place. What on earth is wrong with liberal social democracy? Far better than corrupt, selfish, face stamping Toryism any day.
167
02/03/2021 10:39:59 18 14
bbc
Ubercurmudgeon post.

Nothing to see here. Move along.
183
02/03/2021 10:41:18 32 11
bbc
Starmer has been a v good opposition leader at times, the unions should be backing him up more instead of trying to play king maker
192
02/03/2021 10:41:49 41 12
bbc
Therein lies the problem of the 'forward-thinking progressives'; always fire out an insult rather than explaining how their policies will be better.
350
02/03/2021 10:59:18 32 6
bbc
I am a Tory voter and neither mean-spirited nor reactionary!

Just like many Labour voters are not momentum addicts or want far left socialist policies.

The vast majority of voters for both parties are centre ground and want a balance between capitalism and communism hence why parties who occupy the middle ground win.

This is why Labour loses as they continue to be drawn too far left.
353
02/03/2021 10:59:52 19 3
bbc
mean-spirited! My Mother, a Tory & not rich. Always looked after neighbours and saw they didn't go cold/hungry. One old lady lived next door to a retired Lab' Pit Deputy & he got free coal. None of it was given to anyone else even in the 1963 freeze! I would be sent with buckets of it & my Dad cut wood. I also took her the hot food which we ate! My Mother was taught this by her Father also a Tory!
365
02/03/2021 10:51:20 18 8
bbc
There’s nothing progressive or forward thinking about snp , plaid, lab, Lib Dem who continually oppose a democratic vote and large parts of the Labour Party.
I’m amused by your assertion Tories n Tory voters are not progressive.
478
02/03/2021 11:19:51 11 7
bbc
This is why we need Proportional Representation, so those factions can form their own party. It will be healthier for all sides.
488
02/03/2021 11:19:15 10 10
bbc
Oh look; the usual far left nastiness coming to the fore, aimed at those who don't believe their discredited creed.
"Progressives" is a weasel word, used by the far left to disguise their real Marxist & Trotskyist selves.
577
MVS
02/03/2021 11:42:56 9 5
bbc
You obviously do not go into the pubs of the towns and villages in the Shires. There you will find the honest, decent folk of this country who are neither mean-spirited or reactionary and who realise that old fashioned conservatism is what they believe makes Britain such a great country.
584
02/03/2021 11:43:55 13 4
bbc
This sort of comment represents why far left Labour get a bad name. Your comment is hateful and reactionary. It is wrong to say Tories are mean spirited, just because you disagree with them.
698
02/03/2021 12:08:13 5 4
bbc
The problem, I feel is that the 'forward-thinking progressives' are split between Labour, Lib-Dems, Greens etc and nullify the vote. The right are very good at keeping power. Look at the deal making with Farage.
The only way to solve the dichotomy of 43% of the vote yielding an 80 seat majority is to have electoral reform with PR.
797
02/03/2021 12:25:48 3 2
bbc
That mean spirited and reactionary part of the population generated a huge majority at the last GE. Quite a big part wasn't it?
839
02/03/2021 12:51:26 0 0
bbc
Yet they have you here and don't pay you any attention, I wonder why!
13
02/03/2021 10:17:33 23 31
bbc
Boris Johnson has proven to be a disaster for the country.
69
02/03/2021 10:27:10 1 2
bbc
He has, but that doesn't negate the original point that Sir Keir has proven to be a disaster for the Labour Party.

Two wrong's don't make a right. And Boris being even more of a disaster doesn't mean Sir Keir is any less of one - he just looks it in perspective.
43
02/03/2021 10:22:55 12 6
bbc
The elephant in the room is political parties. It's moronic to vote for a colour or flag. It's unfair our voting system does not allow change and hasn't since the 1900s.
70
02/03/2021 10:27:24 6 7
bbc
The voting system we have was established by the likes of our current government to preserve power for the priveleliged. Of course they don’t want to change it.
71
02/03/2021 10:27:35 109 26
bbc
I actually find Starmer's approach rather refreshing at this point. In a time of national crisis, I prefer that the Opposition are collaborative and not looking for cheap point-scoring with 20/20 hindsight. Labour is doomed though; half of its supporters are working-class Brexiteers, the other half are EU champagne socialists. Whatever Labour does, it will alienate a key proportion of its support.
98
02/03/2021 10:29:10 42 8
bbc
Quite right. "Strident" is not what is needed at the time of the worst national crisis since WW2.
126
02/03/2021 10:34:41 5 0
bbc
Totally agree Ted. There are factions in the Labour Party and factions in the Conservative party. I wonder why they don’t split off and form more new parties.
309
02/03/2021 10:53:57 2 7
bbc
" I prefer that the Opposition are collaborative"

The opposition are there to hold to Government to account, not to get along with them.

Boris has had his head on the block for over a year with his handling of this pandemic but Labour have done absolutely nothing
02/03/2021 18:02:40 0 0
bbc
I assume 'collaborative and not looking for cheap point-scoring with 20/20 hindsight' is sarcasm?
03/03/2021 06:41:54 0 0
bbc
Maybe Starmer should tell his non entity shadow cabinet then, they have done nothing but try to score political points. But Starmer has done himself no favours either as he looks and its not just my opinion to be saying anything that will get him votes hence the flip flop nickname
03/03/2021 11:33:16 0 0
bbc
Sir Kieth is undercover plod.
43
02/03/2021 10:22:55 12 6
bbc
The elephant in the room is political parties. It's moronic to vote for a colour or flag. It's unfair our voting system does not allow change and hasn't since the 1900s.
72
02/03/2021 10:27:42 4 1
bbc
Apart from the referendum held in 2011 regarding proportional representation ??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_United_Kingdom_Alternative_Vote_referendum
134
02/03/2021 10:35:27 0 3
bbc
It wasn't on proportional representation, that vote was on the alternative vote. A system so baffling it was deliberately picked for that referendum, as the Tories knew half the country wouldn't understand it.
35
02/03/2021 10:21:34 3 5
bbc
whatever Bradshaw says (who he?), KS is much of a loser as Ed was. #RecallConference asap last chance to ditch the entire muppet sh. cabinet before locals,Scots,etc. election disaster
73
02/03/2021 10:26:45 1 0
bbc
And replace with whom??
74
KR
02/03/2021 10:26:49 6 11
bbc
Jeremy Corbyn was a far more effective leader than Kier Starmer. It's a wonder why Labour elected someone to lead their party who is so out of touch and far removed from those he is supposed to represent. Kier Starmer is unelectable for as far as I'm concerned. Even bumbling Boris is a far more attractive proposition than Sleepy Starmer. Overall we have a poor choice to choose from
103
02/03/2021 10:31:35 2 2
bbc
Corbyn was a far more effective leader than Starmer ??

He lost two general elections.
112
02/03/2021 10:33:02 1 0
bbc
Jeremy Corbyn was a populist leader who, despite being the only politician who understood the scale of what needed to be done economically for the UK, failed to produce the coherent vision that would win the support of the majority of the country.
246
02/03/2021 10:46:58 0 0
bbc
Most Tory voters would agree with your comments on Corbyn. He very effectively led his party into the desert. Blair took over the centre left, Corbyn handed the cenre left and more to the tories. While Labour pick at the carcass they're left with they become more unelectable by the hour. Starmer isn't the problem, the party is unmanageable, a series of factions pulling in different ways.
50
02/03/2021 10:23:47 58 35
bbc
Somebody should tell him Socialism is rejected.
75
02/03/2021 10:27:05 11 4
bbc
That's not true. Labour's brand of UK socialism is rejected. There's plenty of 'socialist' policy already in place - like the NHS for example.
221
02/03/2021 10:44:17 4 3
bbc
Got to agree there. People rarely appreciate such things until they are gone. Social housing, benefits, education.....the list goes on.
822
02/03/2021 12:37:43 1 1
bbc
That'll be the NHS which the Conservatives not only planned but announced in 1944...

...so not socialist at all:

https://youtu.be/qyjbUK88CB4
15
02/03/2021 10:18:02 103 29
bbc
IMO I think he is a credible opposition to the Tories, who I usually vote for.

I am listening very carefully to what he and other parties are saying. We need to have a real choice when the next elections come up. Not just that of who seems the least worst option!
76
02/03/2021 10:27:50 80 3
bbc
Interesting comment in that I have had to vote for the least worst option for the last 15 years or more. If only there were a party that put common sense ahead of politics and political correctness.
279
02/03/2021 10:50:58 0 5
bbc
Yawn. Political corectness
03/03/2021 09:07:25 0 0
bbc
Current FPTP system = least worse option . The system always has been and always will be defended by the 2 main political party’s. May not be fair to the electorate as a whole but we are not important .
47
02/03/2021 10:23:15 13 9
bbc
Starmer speaks to the public like he is a lawyer presenting a case in court.

You aint going to gee up your core voters with such an approach.

But then Starmer isn't really Labour is he. Just a toned down Blairite.
77
02/03/2021 10:28:02 3 0
bbc
Indeed. The likes of you need a charlatan who talks nice ssit. You know, Corbyn, Johnson, Farage... That will get your vote.
78
02/03/2021 10:28:36 5 4
bbc
Me? Soft right. Always voted Tory. Undecided about Brexit, like Sunak, don't particularly object to Johnson, averse to Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott types. I couldn't bring myself to vote for Blair or Brown. As I get older my leanings are getting softer as our children have their effect and the right gets more loony. It's me who the Labour policy makers should hunt down and convince. Starmer? Hmmm?
114
02/03/2021 10:33:07 1 1
bbc
I'm pretty much the same... centrist right, completely turned off by Corbyn and Abbot but even more turned off by the nutters in the Conservative Party. Keir Starmer would potentially get me to vote Labour for the first time in my life so long as he continues to stand up to the nutters in his own party.
79
02/03/2021 10:28:44 12 5
bbc
It’s the “grassroots activists” and the unions that are the problem, not Starmer. The Loonies have at it in for the party since the 70’s.
676
02/03/2021 12:02:56 1 1
bbc
In the 1970s and 1980s, we have the "Loony Left".

Now we have "the Woke".

Funny how history has a habit of repeating itself - and thereby ensuring a Conservative government in perpetuity.
43
02/03/2021 10:22:55 12 6
bbc
The elephant in the room is political parties. It's moronic to vote for a colour or flag. It's unfair our voting system does not allow change and hasn't since the 1900s.
80
02/03/2021 10:28:51 7 1
bbc
We had a referendum on changing the voting system in 2011 when the LibDems were in the coalition government - we voted to keep it as it is
81
02/03/2021 10:28:52 10 8
bbc
Make no mistake, Keir Starmer has what it takes to be a very successful Prime Minister.

During the pandemic he has acted as one of the few grown-ups in the room and struck exactly the right balance of support and criticism of the government. Something the brattish Tory backbenchers have notably failed to do.

When the pandemic is over you will see why the Tories are afraid of him.
94
02/03/2021 10:30:23 6 7
bbc
By the time the pandemic is over, Starmer won't be leading Labour.
146
02/03/2021 10:36:39 0 0
bbc
Starmer will never be PM until he gets out of Metro land.
The real world happens outside of London.
Too many labour MP's come from cities who have no idea what happens in the shires.
47
02/03/2021 10:23:15 13 9
bbc
Starmer speaks to the public like he is a lawyer presenting a case in court.

You aint going to gee up your core voters with such an approach.

But then Starmer isn't really Labour is he. Just a toned down Blairite.
82
02/03/2021 10:28:53 1 0
bbc
That the "Tory Blair" Labour voters placed into No 10?
Own it.
83
rd
02/03/2021 10:29:09 2 1
bbc
Keep up with the good work of biting each other heads off, I totally support you go deeper and faster, better news to folliw
123
02/03/2021 10:34:01 0 0
bbc
There are, of course, no divisions within the Conservative party, and there never have been.
84
02/03/2021 10:29:14 10 19
bbc
Even when the BBC hands Starmer a HYS all of his very own

Posters just want to talk about Boris.
89
02/03/2021 10:29:53 4 17
bbc
Ouch that's gotta hurt
85
02/03/2021 10:29:20 7 3
bbc
No matter what the loonie lefties of Labour or the equally loony righties of the conservatives claim, the vast majority of voters want a roughly centralist government not beholden to the unions or the Confederation of British Industries. If Starmer had been a Tory, he might have led an acceptable government.
40
02/03/2021 10:19:24 23 15
bbc
WHO cares?????
86
02/03/2021 10:29:23 23 1
bbc
Everyone should. We need a effective opposition, we need choice between good parties!

At voting time I don't want it to be exercise in who I least despise!
87
02/03/2021 10:29:33 8 2
bbc
It's tough for KS: he's stuck between a PM who will shamelessly do whatever is popular with the majority, and a left wing of his own party completely out of touch with reality.
It doesn't help that he's quite boring as well.
231
02/03/2021 10:45:14 2 1
bbc
Only ‘quite’ boring?
88
02/03/2021 10:29:48 4 6
bbc
SKS should be brilliant, but he just isn't! He is trying to appease both sides which makes him come across as willing to say anything to win voters (suddenly brandishing the flag was frankly embarrassing). And, despite the fact it shouldn't matter, his lack of personality and charisma is an issue. Love him or loathe him, BJ has both which means people know who he is.
215
02/03/2021 10:32:40 0 0
bbc
You mean people like that Boris is a serial liar?
216
02/03/2021 10:32:40 0 0
bbc
Absolutely on the money. Excellent summary.
84
02/03/2021 10:29:14 10 19
bbc
Even when the BBC hands Starmer a HYS all of his very own

Posters just want to talk about Boris.
89
02/03/2021 10:29:53 4 17
bbc
Ouch that's gotta hurt
67
02/03/2021 10:25:54 2 1
bbc
Oh dear, I guess you need an explanation, By "charisma", I mean Blair was engaging and persuasive, albeit completely full of it. Starmer is also full of it but has the personality of a crayon.
90
02/03/2021 10:30:01 1 0
bbc
I actually have seen crayons with more charisma. And more political ability. :)
91
02/03/2021 10:30:08 2 3
bbc
The Bank of England is the one holding almost all the new pandemic debt. Hundreds of billions. They printed the money to buy it.

The government owes the pandemic 'debt' to itself.

Any excuses to raise taxes are just that - dishonest excuses. Labour should point this out and not follow them down the austerity rabbit hole.
109
02/03/2021 10:32:40 2 1
bbc
The government saying "we're in debt and need austerity" is a bit like my wife borrowing £10k from me, then going to our kids and saying "we're in a lot of debt, we can't afford your school fees this year".

Ridiculous isn't it?
4
02/03/2021 10:15:00 353 48
bbc
The Momentum Marxists continue their march towards electoral oblivion and do their best to drag the rest of Labour down with them.

Tories are going to be happy.
92
02/03/2021 10:30:09 51 15
bbc
Upsetting the Marxists is a clear sign that he's actually appealing to the electorate and perhaps even on course to win an election.
790
02/03/2021 12:35:09 1 3
bbc
Oh Timmy - so deluded. Labour will never win by being Tory Light and that appears to be all Keir has to offer.
888
02/03/2021 13:08:39 0 1
bbc
Not with the disaster Dodds in tow
68
02/03/2021 10:27:00 113 237
bbc
This country desperately needs a better opposition than any faction of the Labour Party appears to be able to provide. The Tories, or something like the Tories, will always exist to represent the mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. But forward-thinking progressives are poorly served.
93
ant
02/03/2021 10:30:20 79 38
bbc
"mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. " ....you mean those with common sense!
174
02/03/2021 10:40:22 40 5
bbc
No, what he means is anyone who disagrees with him.

He's been on HYS for years and his view is anyone who doesn't share his view is simply wrong.

Democracy, you can't beat it, can you?
270
02/03/2021 10:40:35 18 10
bbc
"mean-spirited and reactionary part of the population. " ....you mean those with common sense!"

No he means "the majority that I sneer at and look down on as they are not as superior, forward thinking and progressive as (enlightened, noble) me!!"
403
02/03/2021 10:57:25 3 17
bbc
The 14m sadists who voted for death
569
02/03/2021 11:41:42 5 10
bbc
No, they clearly mean the tabloid indoctrinated boomer babies who've never had a thought that wasn't put in their empty head by a foreign billionaire.
718
02/03/2021 12:12:43 4 2
bbc
Exactly Ant! Not just the common sense that voted in a one trick pony (and not a good one) government that has presided over 120, 000 deaths, but the same common sense that involves you being able to say that they are doing a great job. I'm just thankful that the rest of us have got all you people with common sense to keep eejits like us on the straight and narrow!
81
02/03/2021 10:28:52 10 8
bbc
Make no mistake, Keir Starmer has what it takes to be a very successful Prime Minister.

During the pandemic he has acted as one of the few grown-ups in the room and struck exactly the right balance of support and criticism of the government. Something the brattish Tory backbenchers have notably failed to do.

When the pandemic is over you will see why the Tories are afraid of him.
94
02/03/2021 10:30:23 6 7
bbc
By the time the pandemic is over, Starmer won't be leading Labour.
40
02/03/2021 10:19:24 23 15
bbc
WHO cares?????
95
02/03/2021 10:30:39 1 0
bbc
You enough to comment?
573
02/03/2021 11:42:13 0 0
bbc
Some areas of the UK may as well be one party states, Scotland and Wales have no effective opposition and never likely to have.
60
02/03/2021 10:26:11 7 6
bbc
Starmer frustrates me because he isn't calling out the damage and chaos of Brexit in order to win back the Red Wall when really he should just be very honest and blunt about it all.

But criticising him for not calling for tax rises before we're even out of the pandemic is madness.
96
02/03/2021 10:30:56 5 1
bbc
If Starmer tries to turn against Brexit, like the Lib Dems did, he will lose even more working class voters. He needs to embrace Brexit to make progress in the next election, because Brexit is going to be a great success. There is no 'chaos'.
202
02/03/2021 10:42:25 0 1
bbc
Brexit is done. I'm talking about the crap deal that's putting people out of business.

But if you want to patronise people by pretending everything is ok....
97
02/03/2021 10:31:09 0 5
bbc
Sir Bossy Cop is as much an undercover agent as the rapists he defended as DPP. His/Blair's entire strategy involves prostrating himself before the court & purging progressives in a futile effort to prove the Labour Party is no longer a threat to the establishment. Won't change the fact that despite 24/7 MSM lies 40% of the public voted for a threat to *their* national security though. Tick tock.
210
02/03/2021 10:43:18 0 1
bbc
43% voted Tory, 2019 GE, and I agree they're a threat to national security.
71
02/03/2021 10:27:35 109 26
bbc
I actually find Starmer's approach rather refreshing at this point. In a time of national crisis, I prefer that the Opposition are collaborative and not looking for cheap point-scoring with 20/20 hindsight. Labour is doomed though; half of its supporters are working-class Brexiteers, the other half are EU champagne socialists. Whatever Labour does, it will alienate a key proportion of its support.
98
02/03/2021 10:29:10 42 8
bbc
Quite right. "Strident" is not what is needed at the time of the worst national crisis since WW2.
291
02/03/2021 10:43:52 3 9
bbc
What happened after WW2? Nationalisation, full employment, the Welfare State and the most Socialist government this country has had.

What you're proposing after COVID-19 - Wealth divide increasing, people working and having to use food banks, Cabinet Ministers freely allowed to unlawfully award contracts.

Save the WW2 flag waving nonsense if you're actually advocating the exact opposite.
03/03/2021 06:42:18 0 0
bbc
Why a quick nuclear bomb would burn away all virus's
62
02/03/2021 10:26:26 20 12
bbc
Corbyn had his chance and failed, so his supporters need to get behind Starmer.

We need a decent opposition to hold Johnson and his cronies to account, infighting within the Opposition will not do that.
99
02/03/2021 10:31:09 4 19
bbc
First there's the need to big up Starmer without insulting the Tories, though

Unlucky
147
02/03/2021 10:37:12 1 2
bbc
Define "insulting".
100
02/03/2021 10:31:16 5 4
bbc
Looking at national polling would suggest that it's not just the 'left' who are turned off by Starmer - 20 points ahead anyone?