Which way will the 'GOAT race' turn?
21/02/2021 | sport | tennis | 1,092
Not only was Novak Djokovic playing for the Australian Open title on Sunday, he was jostling for position in the race to be crowned the 'GOAT' in men's tennis.
1
21/02/2021 16:17:09 20 6
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Surely Djokovic will ultimately win the most. He is a machine and the competition is weak: most opponents are beaten before they take the court.
75
21/02/2021 22:18:16 11 8
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Realy?Djokovic has weak opponents?If that is case he is GOAT because Nadal nad Federer are weak opponents...
298
22/02/2021 07:25:41 1 1
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The competition hasn't always been weak but at the moment it is!
497
22/02/2021 10:24:51 1 0
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But equally how many slams did Federer win in the era where Safin, Rafter, Hewitt and Baghdatis were the most competition he faced? Novak had to come into the tour at a point where it was dominated by Federer and Nadal and he was able to surpass both of them in 2011-2015.
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21/02/2021 16:21:44 21 16
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Djokovic
3
21/02/2021 16:23:33 7 14
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Roger is the greatest! Not only because he has won the most titles, but more importantly because his manners and humility make him a true legend.
17
21/02/2021 17:18:44 7 6
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Really? Have you seen Federer's tantrums when he was losing in the 2000's? GIve us a break. He is the most ungracious loser on the court. Never one to admit his opponent was better.
4
21/02/2021 16:26:47 9 6
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Would be nice for Novac to win French and Wimbledon.
Then the big 3 can have a show down in the US, where Medvedev will probably win!!
765
22/02/2021 14:29:27 0 0
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No it wouldn’t.
22/02/2021 20:05:25 0 0
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It would not be nice at all - and he doesn't stand a chance on the clay against Rafa the Legend.
Yeah Med probably would win - hope he does
5
21/02/2021 16:28:03 9 13
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You cannot even associate the word great with someone who repeatedly shows moody impatience to the ballboys/ballgirls.
Self obsessed,moody,insincere.........a shortfuse exhibitionist IMO
18
21/02/2021 17:19:17 5 6
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Yep, that's Federer for you.
20
21/02/2021 17:21:01 1 1
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Gee whiz, I bet you were a bundle of laughs at school.
6
21/02/2021 16:38:18 72 8
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Suspect this is just to give you folks something to bite on. Imagine if Borg had played into his middle thirties rather than quitting at 26? His win GS to appearances percentage is better than all 3 and remember he did not play Paris in for a couple of years in late 70s. Discussion is just bogus!
12
21/02/2021 17:13:21 33 3
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Plus Borg only ever played the Aus Open ONCE in his career!!
16
21/02/2021 17:17:24 9 1
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While Borg was great player you can't base anything on what he might have done, great player & top 10 for sure.
84
21/02/2021 23:02:34 2 1
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Used to love watching Borg but sad to say he was a quitter.
149
22/02/2021 01:11:49 12 4
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Hmmm. Borg was a genius. But like you say, he quit at 26. He didn’t have the mental fortitude to do what these 3 have done (in a far more physically demanding era). I really don’t want to be a downer on Borg as he’s a legend... but this post is (IMO) close to “I could have made it if...” yeh but you didn’t
246
22/02/2021 05:24:00 4 0
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Yh and imagine if Federer retired at 27. Maybe there’s a reason he finished so early. There are no what ifs in sport, only what you’ve achieved.
454
22/02/2021 09:52:09 3 0
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Longevity is mentioned in the article, so that should be taken into account when adding Borg to the discussion.
476
22/02/2021 10:07:20 3 0
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It's a good point, though what ifs are a bit silly, I agree. But following that logic with another player. Jimmy Connors (8 Slams) only played the AO twice (W and RU 1974/75) and was banned from the FO for 5 years at his peak. He could easily have ended up with double figures if he'd carried on playing the AO. Baring in mind he continued winning slams until 1983.
477
22/02/2021 10:09:39 7 0
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And how many slams would Laver have won if professionals hadn't been banned until 1968?
493
22/02/2021 10:22:12 0 0
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Also he didn't play australian open when it was considered an irrelelvance
499
22/02/2021 10:25:53 0 1
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Borg new his time at the top was done, McEnroe had overtaken him.
883
22/02/2021 17:10:33 0 0
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if we're going with "what ifs" then I'll thrown my hat in to the ring, I would have been the GOAT if only I hadn't retired at the age of 14 and been good at tennis.
955
22/02/2021 19:09:40 0 0
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Novaks Decade of Dominance is more than equal to Feds dominance from 03 to 2010. Novak added 16 slams and 4 year end, World Tour Finals and was dominant in the 1000 events as well. Novak had a record of 21 wins and 9 or 10 losses against each of those 2 players in that decade. Now for some "talking points", Novak has 5 out of the top 6 years in wins over "top 10" players. As to why? Tougher draws!
958
22/02/2021 19:13:37 0 0
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Borg vs Nadal on clay would have been something to relish. Both put incredible topspin on the ball but Borg did it with wooden racquets. Just don't know.
975
22/02/2021 19:23:56 0 0
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Like rafa, borg was an early bloomer. Both Fed and Nole took a few more years to develop. When taking the best 5 to 6 year spread of each into that consideration...then?
7
21/02/2021 16:39:55 34 21
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Djokovic is GOAT at the moment. Then Federer and Nadal comes to third. Federer won at least 5-6 Grandslams when there was not big names in early 2000 after retirement of Agassi and Sampras. Djokovic and Nadal won during the most competitive time period. However, Nadal did not win more on different surfaces compared to Djokovic. Djokovic is leading head to head to all leading players.
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21/02/2021 17:14:55 19 38
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Totally right. Federer was racking up slams against nobodys through 2003 - 2008 until Nadal, and then Novak, came along. Just look at the chart in the article. Had the situation been reversed, Federer wouldn't even be in the mix. He would perhaps have won 2-3 majors at best.
82
21/02/2021 22:55:26 2 2
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In fact Federer only played against Sampras once - he beat him at Wimbledon. That was more or less that for Pistol Pete.
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22/02/2021 00:42:47 4 3
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Djoko only won 1 slam on clay and that was when Rafa was playing on one leg

Djoko had advantage that more slams are on hard courts

Imagine if 2 were on grass or 2 on clay
Fed and Rafa would have 30 slams by now
Djoko is still great but third best
165
om
22/02/2021 01:40:39 4 5
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Djoko had no competition in last decade as federer has been on decline since 2011 and no one else has step up their game. He is lucky in that way. He is leading only because he took Advantage of them being on decline and no one stepped up
8
21/02/2021 16:40:27 5 16
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of the modern great players most experts agree that Murray is the most talented is has been unlucky not to win 20 odd majors. and he's a clean athlete,
144
22/02/2021 01:07:11 0 0
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??
9
21/02/2021 16:58:37 3 11
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Maybe the GOAT should be defined by how many slams each competitor has won not at their favourite venue/ surface.

On that measure we have
Federer 12
Nadal 7
Djokovic 9

No contest really.

No con
15
21/02/2021 17:17:16 5 0
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Federer has won 11 on hard courts, how is that not his favourite surface?
232
22/02/2021 04:05:07 0 0
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Margaret Court has won the most Grand Slams (so far) ! She is the GE (Greatest Ever) !
10
21/02/2021 17:07:06 10 6
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Having followed all three over their careers, regardless of how many slams they end up with I thought at the time ND dismantling of RN at 2011 wimbledon followed by his win over RN at the 2012 AO as the highest level of tennis I've ever seem to date, ND all round game is I think superior, his head to head plus having completed the slam puts him above everyone else.
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22/02/2021 04:36:17 6 4
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Djokovic against Federer in AO semis 2016 first 2 sets. He absolutely ran Federer ragged
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21/02/2021 17:07:49 72 30
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Having followed all three over their careers, regardless of how many slams they end up with I thought at the time ND dismantling of RN at 2011 wimbledon followed by his win over RN at the 2012 AO as the highest level of tennis I've ever seem to date, ND all round game is I think superior, his head to head plus having completed the slam puts him above everyone else.
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22/02/2021 03:07:03 70 26
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Djokovic is benefitted by there being 2 slams on his favourite surface.

If there were 2 slams each year on clay, then Rafa would be on 30+ by now and this wouldn't even be a debate!!
6
21/02/2021 16:38:18 72 8
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Suspect this is just to give you folks something to bite on. Imagine if Borg had played into his middle thirties rather than quitting at 26? His win GS to appearances percentage is better than all 3 and remember he did not play Paris in for a couple of years in late 70s. Discussion is just bogus!
12
21/02/2021 17:13:21 33 3
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Plus Borg only ever played the Aus Open ONCE in his career!!
101
21/02/2021 23:58:12 6 1
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True. He never feigned injury while trailing
7
21/02/2021 16:39:55 34 21
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Djokovic is GOAT at the moment. Then Federer and Nadal comes to third. Federer won at least 5-6 Grandslams when there was not big names in early 2000 after retirement of Agassi and Sampras. Djokovic and Nadal won during the most competitive time period. However, Nadal did not win more on different surfaces compared to Djokovic. Djokovic is leading head to head to all leading players.
13
21/02/2021 17:14:55 19 38
bbc
Totally right. Federer was racking up slams against nobodys through 2003 - 2008 until Nadal, and then Novak, came along. Just look at the chart in the article. Had the situation been reversed, Federer wouldn't even be in the mix. He would perhaps have won 2-3 majors at best.
102
21/02/2021 23:59:50 12 1
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Was that his fault ? You can only beat who is in front of you. Surely Medvedev is a nobody
By your analysis, Jokers win last night doesn't count for much.
148
22/02/2021 01:11:19 1 1
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He did beat Sampras and Agassi during period
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22/02/2021 01:30:44 10 0
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During 2003-2008 Roger Federer won ten finals against multiple Grand Slam winners and 7 former or future world number 1s in the world including Rafael Nadal, Novak Djokovic, Andy Murray, Andy Roddick, Andre Agassi, Lleyton Hewitt and Marat Safin. I am sure they would love to be referred to as nobody's!
166
om
22/02/2021 01:41:29 2 0
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Same can be said for djoko. Who stepped up their game in last decade.
664
22/02/2021 12:45:48 0 0
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Well he found a way to beat Nadal, who has only beaten federer once in the last 5 meetings (the french ), it's nole that bothers him now, i dont think he would care if rafa got 21, but with the disruption Nole seems to create ( ie the ATP board members ) i dont think he has a lot of time for him, simple as that,
921
22/02/2021 18:21:29 0 0
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Fed has always given 5 years in age to Nadal and Novak. Fed's victory over Nadal at AO in 2017 showed his mastery! It will be interesting to see when Nadal and Novak are 37/38 and play people 5 years younger to them.
14
21/02/2021 17:17:14 5 11
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Federer is no GOAT. He won over half his slams before 2009, against poor competition and nobodys. Just look at the chart in the article. As soon as Rafa and Nole came along Federer was found out.

Had Fed been 10 years younger, he would have been the same as today's crop of 20-somethings: Zverev, Medvedev, Thiem. He would have won at best 2-3 slams.
43
21/02/2021 19:17:36 4 3
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Yes and he won his last three when Djokovic was out injured else he could have been still on 17
103
22/02/2021 00:02:20 0 0
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Sure. Fed never feigned an injury to put off his opponents while trailing them. Get your joker tinted glasses off and be objective.
9
21/02/2021 16:58:37 3 11
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Maybe the GOAT should be defined by how many slams each competitor has won not at their favourite venue/ surface.

On that measure we have
Federer 12
Nadal 7
Djokovic 9

No contest really.

No con
15
21/02/2021 17:17:16 5 0
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Federer has won 11 on hard courts, how is that not his favourite surface?
32
21/02/2021 17:59:30 1 3
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Ok that's a fair point, lets do it your way. Let's say that both Federer and Djokovic like hard courts best.

That gives on non favourite surface
Federer 10
Nadal 7
Djokovic 6.

Federer is still the most versatile.
160
22/02/2021 01:31:36 0 0
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He has a poor record on clay. No way you can be classed as the greatest of all time when his record on clay is not very good
6
21/02/2021 16:38:18 72 8
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Suspect this is just to give you folks something to bite on. Imagine if Borg had played into his middle thirties rather than quitting at 26? His win GS to appearances percentage is better than all 3 and remember he did not play Paris in for a couple of years in late 70s. Discussion is just bogus!
16
21/02/2021 17:17:24 9 1
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While Borg was great player you can't base anything on what he might have done, great player & top 10 for sure.
3
21/02/2021 16:23:33 7 14
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Roger is the greatest! Not only because he has won the most titles, but more importantly because his manners and humility make him a true legend.
17
21/02/2021 17:18:44 7 6
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Really? Have you seen Federer's tantrums when he was losing in the 2000's? GIve us a break. He is the most ungracious loser on the court. Never one to admit his opponent was better.
5
21/02/2021 16:28:03 9 13
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You cannot even associate the word great with someone who repeatedly shows moody impatience to the ballboys/ballgirls.
Self obsessed,moody,insincere.........a shortfuse exhibitionist IMO
18
21/02/2021 17:19:17 5 6
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Yep, that's Federer for you.
100
21/02/2021 23:56:55 1 0
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Joker injure when he trails. Yep. Rent free in your head
230
22/02/2021 04:03:24 0 0
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Funny !
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21/02/2021 17:20:37 3 0
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If they all finish on the same number if any of them win all of them twice or more (currently they all have one that they have only won once). Unlikely Fed will win the FO so comes down to if ND can beat Nadal on clay or if Nadal can beat ND in Aus next year. I wouldn't put much money on either really!
5
21/02/2021 16:28:03 9 13
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You cannot even associate the word great with someone who repeatedly shows moody impatience to the ballboys/ballgirls.
Self obsessed,moody,insincere.........a shortfuse exhibitionist IMO
20
21/02/2021 17:21:01 1 1
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Gee whiz, I bet you were a bundle of laughs at school.
21
21/02/2021 17:21:18 26 16
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Djokovic
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21/02/2021 17:21:29 12 12
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So, Federer has a losing H2H v both Nadal (very bad losing H2H) and vs Djokovic.

Not a small sample size. Played nearly 90 matches combined v both.
Has a losing record in slams v both.
Won most of his slams v creampuff competition - Roddick, Baghdatis, Gonzalez, Hewitt, Philippoussis, etc.

Yeah, he was not the best of his time, but he is the best of all time.
That makes a lot of sense.
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22/02/2021 00:54:09 3 2
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And you are a leading expert on tennis? A "weaker period" Tell that to the players who played during the so called weak period.
Djokovic was a joker at the start of his career. Feds head to head was far superior against Djokovic. Now Djokovic has over taken him.
What is your point? Thanks for the nonsensical stats.
Btw they will all achieve more than you ever will in your life.
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22/02/2021 03:28:10 1 0
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Roddick, Baghdatis, Gonzalez, Hewitt, Philippoussis, etc. 'Creampuffs' - what a Nonsense comment ! - Hewitt, for example, was the World Number One ! - 'Creampuffs' do not become Number One of the world ! -
23
21/02/2021 17:24:12 42 32
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Djokovic:

H2H v both Federer and Nadal.
Won most of his slams beating other greats. No Hewitt, ROddick, Gonzalez, Baghdatis, Philippoussis (does anyone even remember this bloke?) etc.
Most weeks at #1 soon
Most Masters 1000 - won each of them at least twice. Others? Yet to win 2 of the 9

6 years at #1 at the end of the year. One more than other two.
100 more weeks at #1 than Nadal
29
21/02/2021 17:46:23 48 25
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Federer was already in slight decline when Djokovic started his proper run. During those years when he beat Federer in the majors, many of the tourneys that were best of 2 sets Federer won those, basically signifying it was a matter of endurance. I'd say in pure SKILL, it is Federer, Djokovic and then Nadal.
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22/02/2021 00:39:57 2 10
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You forget the other two have missed at least 2 years due to serious injuries

Djoko has a big advantage that most tournaments are played on his favourite surface

Imagine if Nadal had 2 slams to win every year on clay
Exactly!
Rafa is undeniable GOAT with Fed second
140
22/02/2021 01:05:18 5 7
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They slowed the courts and the balls down on all surfaces as others couldn't cope with the speed like Fed who at the time was single handily dominating tennis.
That is a fact.
Why would you want to slow play down on grass when clay is a slug fest?
Why is it Fed and Nadal have a good relationship, but not so much with Djokovic? Enlighten me with more iof your drivel!
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22/02/2021 01:53:48 4 1
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Exactly. Djokovic has just faced Anderson and Tsonga who could be considered weaker in finals, 25/27 of his slam finals vs great great players. Federer 28% vs Djoko/Nadal in slam finals. 30% vs Djoko in all finals, 0% at Wimbledon, 0% in Masters finals, 33% in GS matches. Nadal too high a % at RG. Fed is very lucky he won that 2017 Aus final otherwise his record in slams would be awful vs those 2
292
22/02/2021 07:21:30 4 2
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So Kate. Serious question.

Are you an objective tennis fan through this debate? It’s just ALL the posts which have your name on it, seem like a silly little girl who is besotted with her favourite tennis player.

I mean no offence, it’s just your love for Novak and your pure hatred for Roger shines brighter than any of the three careers we are all considering.

Kate G F GOAT stalker fan.
299
22/02/2021 07:29:31 2 1
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It's sad to see people have upvoted anything by this troll, I thought tennis HYS's had a bit more sense than the football ones.
22/02/2021 20:54:48 0 0
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yes ticks all the boxes for the GOAT
24
21/02/2021 17:24:40 4 5
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Of those three I'd pkace it like this:

1 Djokovic
2 Nadal
3 Federer

But, consider if Laver had not been banned for 5 years for turning pro?

What if Borg hadn't retired before his 27th birthday and had played the Australian Open more than once?

Allowing for changes in equipment, surfaces, sports science, nutrition and supplements?

1 Borg
2 Laver
3 Djokovic
4 Nadal
5 Federer
25
21/02/2021 17:28:35 3 1
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Laver also benefited because pros did not participate when he won in 61 and 62.

What goes around comes around.

Hoad and even more so, Pancho Gonzalez were super awesome. Had they been playing, Laver would not have any in 61/62.

Gonzalez, not Laver, was the one lost out in record books due to pros not competing then
138
22/02/2021 01:00:59 0 0
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Was tennis as global then, as it is now? I don’t agree with this argument- tennis was a privileged sport. There was never a Serena Williams from the Hoods
24
21/02/2021 17:24:40 4 5
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Of those three I'd pkace it like this:

1 Djokovic
2 Nadal
3 Federer

But, consider if Laver had not been banned for 5 years for turning pro?

What if Borg hadn't retired before his 27th birthday and had played the Australian Open more than once?

Allowing for changes in equipment, surfaces, sports science, nutrition and supplements?

1 Borg
2 Laver
3 Djokovic
4 Nadal
5 Federer
25
21/02/2021 17:28:35 3 1
bbc
Laver also benefited because pros did not participate when he won in 61 and 62.

What goes around comes around.

Hoad and even more so, Pancho Gonzalez were super awesome. Had they been playing, Laver would not have any in 61/62.

Gonzalez, not Laver, was the one lost out in record books due to pros not competing then
26
21/02/2021 17:32:28 8 10
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My top 3 tennis ?? players of all time are:

1. Buster Mottram
2. Tim Henman
3. Andrew Castle

3 absolute legends of the sport who have never got the respect or adulation they all fully deserve. Opinions vary and I respect that. ???????
226
22/02/2021 03:59:51 0 0
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Ha ha ha !
27
21/02/2021 17:35:51 0 2
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Another pointless HYS
28
21/02/2021 17:41:46 9 15
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Many of Wimby crowd is racist. The same is reflected in HYS. The hatred to Serena is disgraceful. A similar attitude is shown to Djokovic. But these two are the very best of all time, bar none.

Hopefully Osaka will challenge Serena's slam total. She is an amazing young lady. Inspiring. No doubt WImby crowds will be hostile to Osaka too (obvious reason, something to do with skin and all that)
77
21/02/2021 22:20:43 8 0
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A lot of tennis fans I have spoken to have disliked Serena and Djokovic. I don't believe it is anything to do with racism, but more about how they come across both on court and in interviews . Nor do I believe Wimbledon crowds are racist. They will embrace Naomi Osaka just as they did Venus Williams, Zina Garrison etc
83
21/02/2021 23:00:19 2 0
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Have to disagree with you on two counts. I can't see that crowd turning on Osaka - they never have on Serena or Venus. They hate Novak because of what he's done to (swoon) Roger. And it remains to be seen how dominant she will be. Matching Williams S will take some doing.
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22/02/2021 00:56:13 1 2
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Agree with this. There is a lingering anti Eastern European sentiment that is clouding people’s judgements here. Djokovic is Serbian and that brings utter revulsion in some people.

Get over it, he is the very best
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22/02/2021 03:58:33 1 0
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Kate stop your sill 'Wimby' - it is WIMBLEDON !
23
21/02/2021 17:24:12 42 32
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Djokovic:

H2H v both Federer and Nadal.
Won most of his slams beating other greats. No Hewitt, ROddick, Gonzalez, Baghdatis, Philippoussis (does anyone even remember this bloke?) etc.
Most weeks at #1 soon
Most Masters 1000 - won each of them at least twice. Others? Yet to win 2 of the 9

6 years at #1 at the end of the year. One more than other two.
100 more weeks at #1 than Nadal
29
21/02/2021 17:46:23 48 25
bbc
Federer was already in slight decline when Djokovic started his proper run. During those years when he beat Federer in the majors, many of the tourneys that were best of 2 sets Federer won those, basically signifying it was a matter of endurance. I'd say in pure SKILL, it is Federer, Djokovic and then Nadal.
35
21/02/2021 18:06:50 20 6
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Djokovic won 3 slams in 2011
Are you saying Federer was already in slight decline by 2011?
Funny how that works. He was then what, 29 years? A little early for someone to begin his decline, given he is being hailed for lasting till 39 now.

Novak is 33 now and thrashing the best of the next gen. Why did Fed decline so early?
146
22/02/2021 01:09:20 2 0
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Federer was in slight decline. He won at least ten slams in his thirties so he was still decent
404
22/02/2021 09:16:38 1 0
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If you are now comparing 3 set records, who has won most Masters series?
828
22/02/2021 15:34:53 0 0
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this is as ridiculous as I I'd say, Federer won all his early GS because Novak was just too young.
30
21/02/2021 17:55:21 208 9
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There is no clear cut number one. Federer is perhaps the greatest ever on Grass and Nadal certainly the greatest ever on clay. And Djokovic might well finish with more grand slams than both of them. The point is that they are all tremendous players and will be remembered as 3 of the all time greats regardless of who you think is the GOAT
34
21/02/2021 18:02:04 78 167
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Djokovic beat Federer 3 times at Wimby, twice in finals. Federer beat him at Wimby ONCE.

Federer won his 5 Wimbys in 2003-07, before Djoker even came out of teens. Fairly weak period for tennis in those days. He also sneaked in one Wimby in 2017 when Djoker was dealing with injury.
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22/02/2021 06:39:26 7 0
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Its the old chestnut and nothing changes. Nadal clay; Federer and Djokovic anything but clay. Then there are past players like Laver who played with old wooden racquets and without today's massive support groups. Federer has been magic to watch for me but other people have their favourites and can get quite emotional about that.
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22/02/2021 07:12:30 11 0
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Surely if three people are SO close in terms of achievements, then none of them are Goats. Just great players.

A goat is someone like, it pains me to say, Tom Brady who has the individual record which puts ALL the other players in the shade.

When the competition is that close, take your GOAT talk somewhere else.
376
22/02/2021 08:58:53 4 0
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I think the gap on grass would be wider were the courts as fast as they used to be. Nadal is indisputably the clay court GOAT, Federer is the GOAT on indoor courts, proper grass and fast hard courts whereas Djokovic is probably the best allrounder- second to the other two on their best surfaces and the GOAT on medium pace hard courts.
420
22/02/2021 09:25:30 3 0
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I was about to comment the same thing.....I think Djoker has been the most consistent on all surfaces out of the 3 of them.
431
22/02/2021 09:34:22 3 5
bbc
The point with Djokovic is his longevity and fitness - that will probably see his get the most GS titles and on paper look like he was the best, but the fact is he only really started to dominate once Federer was past his best and injuries had taken a toll on Nadal. He's not quite at the same level playing wise he's just had a clearer path to his titles.
472
TT
22/02/2021 10:04:54 1 3
bbc
Apart from the unbelievable game he has, Djokovic seriously wants to ram the critics' words down their throats over & over again - that's his edge

Federer is easily the most powerful of the 3 which has always given him a massive natural advantage (& is how he looks so serene on the surface).

Only 1 of the slams is on Nadal's preferred surface, which puts his achievement above the other 2 for me.
475
22/02/2021 10:07:11 1 0
bbc
Djokovic has beaten federer I’m 3 wimbledon finals
598
22/02/2021 11:43:12 2 0
bbc
This is how we should be viewing this, agreed! Most sensible
881
22/02/2021 17:05:36 2 0
bbc
difficult comparison - Federer had won a lot of titles before Nadal and Djokovic (and Murray, remember him as part of the big 4?!) became professional, and you can see from the graph in the article that his numbers went down once Nadal and Djokovic got competitive. No mention in the article of Djokovic being the only one to hold all four grand slams at once?
946
22/02/2021 19:01:29 0 0
bbc
Novaks Decade of Dominance is more than equal to Feds dominance from 03 to 2010. Novak added 16 slams and 4 year end, World Tour Finals and was dominant in the 1000 events as well. Novak had a record of 21 wins and 9 or 10 losses against each of those 2 players in that decade. Now for some "talking points", Novak has 5 out of the top 6 years in wins over "top 10" players. As to why? Tougher draws!
951
22/02/2021 19:06:52 0 0
bbc
Nice summary. As an old guy I would raise the flag a bit for Laver. He won the Grand Slam and would have won more but for Pro-Am distinction. I tend to look at skills and Laver was a superior volleyer (different era, mind you) while equal in all other aspects except serve although I think with racquet technology he would have closed that gap. Nevertheless my votes for Federer. So elegant.
986
22/02/2021 19:33:38 0 0
bbc
Well said! Enjoy the fact that by freak of time they are playing in the same era. Imagine a football World Cup with Pele, Maradona, Cruyff, Best, Messi, Zidane et al! Tennis fans don’t realise how lucky they are.
22/02/2021 20:52:48 0 1
bbc
Federer, easily the greatest. He in his prime made it look effortless, his reading of the game is phenomenal, that's why he's still in the mix for grandslams at near 40. Both Djokovic and Nadal rely more on physicality. Going further back McEnroe, might not have won the titles but in terms of shot making ability, second to none.
31
21/02/2021 17:58:26 38 27
bbc
Forgetting that I am a big fan of Novak and considering the top three current form, I would say that Novak still stands the chance of overtaking the remaining two in the race to become the GOAT. His doggedness and never giving up attitude plays a big role. I wish he could add the Olympics to his collection of trophies . Novak is the GOAT!
117
22/02/2021 00:36:48 21 25
bbc
Novak is third best

Fed and Rafa equal GOAT
280
22/02/2021 07:05:58 0 0
bbc
I think, currently, Nadal is the GOAT but i do believe Djokovic will overtake him sooner or later. Add that to his Masters wins across all tournaments and ATP Finals, and he's a clear winner for me if he also wins the most Grand Slams. Fed will likely end 3rd but his style of tennis has been the most enjoyable to watch. I do get chills watching Djok too though. Truly blessed to have watched the 3.
575
22/02/2021 11:24:17 0 0
bbc
Seriously? Highest number of grand slams does NOT make you the GOAT
15
21/02/2021 17:17:16 5 0
bbc
Federer has won 11 on hard courts, how is that not his favourite surface?
32
21/02/2021 17:59:30 1 3
bbc
Ok that's a fair point, lets do it your way. Let's say that both Federer and Djokovic like hard courts best.

That gives on non favourite surface
Federer 10
Nadal 7
Djokovic 6.

Federer is still the most versatile.
33
21/02/2021 18:00:49 7 2
bbc
Depends how you like your tennis. All 3 are craftsman in their own way. All 3 have a favourite surface, which in their prime made them virtually unbeatable on.
RF would be my GOAT, ND will end up with the most GS titles, but if I wanted someone to guarantee a win for me, I would choose RN at the French Open!
What makes them great, is the longevity of their time at or near the top of their sport.
30
21/02/2021 17:55:21 208 9
bbc
There is no clear cut number one. Federer is perhaps the greatest ever on Grass and Nadal certainly the greatest ever on clay. And Djokovic might well finish with more grand slams than both of them. The point is that they are all tremendous players and will be remembered as 3 of the all time greats regardless of who you think is the GOAT
34
21/02/2021 18:02:04 78 167
bbc
Djokovic beat Federer 3 times at Wimby, twice in finals. Federer beat him at Wimby ONCE.

Federer won his 5 Wimbys in 2003-07, before Djoker even came out of teens. Fairly weak period for tennis in those days. He also sneaked in one Wimby in 2017 when Djoker was dealing with injury.
60
21/02/2021 21:21:59 22 20
bbc
It's a fair point but Djoker and Nadal are also significantly younger than Federer, however Nadal was able to regularly beat Federer in his prime. Federer possibly has the most stylish form of play but overall Djokovic and Nadal are in my opinion a level above Federer.
163
om
22/02/2021 01:39:02 16 15
bbc
Djoko had no competition in last decade as federer has been on decline since 2011 and no one else has step up their game. He is lucky in that way
197
22/02/2021 02:59:31 34 1
bbc
What's a 'Wimby' ? ? ? Gee !
243
qpr
22/02/2021 05:09:26 23 1
bbc
where exactly is "wimby"!!!!!!!!!!
321
22/02/2021 08:00:40 1 7
bbc
It’s how you carry yourself apart from your trophies that you have won, I’m sorry but have never particularly liked Nole, his attitude when winning is often bigheaded, I remember when a few years ago he played a British player, ranked outside the top 100, as he was beating him his head when up and down as to say “ there in the boss “ something Federer wouldn’t do,
341
22/02/2021 08:23:19 13 1
bbc
lol if you're going to call it Wimby then you should be banned from commenting
362
22/02/2021 08:49:03 3 1
bbc
What is a Wimby?
368
22/02/2021 08:52:31 4 1
bbc
Wimby? Weak.
449
22/02/2021 09:49:30 4 3
bbc
Federer is also six years older than Djokovic. I’m sure if their ages had been reversed that Federer would have the superior head-to-head.
557
22/02/2021 11:02:44 4 0
bbc
Who on earth calls Wimbledon, Wimby?!
611
22/02/2021 11:52:16 0 0
bbc
Djokovic beat him in three Wimbledon finals. The highest quality match was probably the 2014 one even though 2019 was more dramatic. All three were classics really.
666
22/02/2021 12:47:35 3 1
bbc
Is it too difficult to spell Wimbledon or am I missing something?
747
22/02/2021 14:05:57 2 0
bbc
"Wimby"? Who on earth calls it "Wimby"?
Are you 12?
835
22/02/2021 15:41:40 2 0
bbc
Wimby? Djoker? Is there some sort of pixel shortage going on that I didn't know about? This is exactly the sort of nonsense that puts me off tennis and those who follow it.
894
22/02/2021 17:27:18 0 0
bbc
Pretty sure he beat him in three finals at Wimbledon.
906
22/02/2021 17:52:53 0 0
bbc
Neither of them go to wimpys
22/02/2021 19:58:08 0 1
bbc
You could argue Djokovic came good as Federer was on the way down and he had some decent competition back then who never won a slam because of him. And Federer blew his chance at Wimbledon last time when he was clearly the better player but choked on some big points. I agree with Progress44 they are all legends and Federer the best ever on grass!
22/02/2021 20:07:08 1 0
bbc
Roger's fans cannot read and comprehend the above article... IT is actually very objective and full of factual information. Wimby 2009, age 27 and 15 GS. Only 5 since then... Where has he been since? And if Andy & Novak had not disappeared simultaneously in 2017 & 2018 (#1 and #2 players in the world at the beginning of 2017) RF would not have won the 3 GS (18,19 & 20)... No GOAT discussion!?
29
21/02/2021 17:46:23 48 25
bbc
Federer was already in slight decline when Djokovic started his proper run. During those years when he beat Federer in the majors, many of the tourneys that were best of 2 sets Federer won those, basically signifying it was a matter of endurance. I'd say in pure SKILL, it is Federer, Djokovic and then Nadal.
35
21/02/2021 18:06:50 20 6
bbc
Djokovic won 3 slams in 2011
Are you saying Federer was already in slight decline by 2011?
Funny how that works. He was then what, 29 years? A little early for someone to begin his decline, given he is being hailed for lasting till 39 now.

Novak is 33 now and thrashing the best of the next gen. Why did Fed decline so early?
137
22/02/2021 01:00:48 6 4
bbc
What decline? He is still playing going on 40. I bet you are the kind that said back in 2012 Fed will not win another slam. Yet 2017 and 2018 the man came good. What will you be doing at 40? Posting utter drivel?
36
21/02/2021 18:30:08 2 10
bbc
Federer is the goat
37
21/02/2021 18:40:02 2 9
bbc
The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style. Add all these attributes to the titles won and then you get your true goat : FEDERER . He is elegant and graceful
Most people started watching tennis to see Federer.
39
21/02/2021 18:58:08 5 1
bbc
"The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style"

In other words, whatever floats your boat. Numbers don't matter, what a specific poster called Cruiser thinks matters a lot.

Got it.
42
21/02/2021 19:14:58 2 0
bbc
1. Number of slams
2. H2HS
3. Masters
4. Style

Thats how it should be decided
56
21/02/2021 20:43:24 1 0
bbc
Firstly, personality has no impact on your tennis ability. Neither does it matter what your playing style is. Federer's playing style may be more aesthetically pleasing that but its about how effective you technique is.
71
21/02/2021 22:01:06 0 1
bbc
Only real measure who is better between two players is H2H(with enough matches).How can Federer or Nadal be considered GOAT if they both have negative H2H against Djokovic?Number of slams,masters and all other titles can only be used to compare players who play in different times.If we use number of titles to measure players who have H2H we can only see who is a better achiever and not GOAT.
38
21/02/2021 18:41:37 3 14
bbc
Djokovic will finish on about 24 , Nadal 22 and Federer 20 .

However, I’d rather watch Federer than Nadal , and Nadal before Djokovic.

So Djokovic will finish having won the most grand slams , but for that reason he won’t be my G.O.A.T.
234
22/02/2021 04:07:03 0 0
bbc
So Far - MARGARET COURT is the Greatest - having won the MOST Grand Slams !
37
21/02/2021 18:40:02 2 9
bbc
The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style. Add all these attributes to the titles won and then you get your true goat : FEDERER . He is elegant and graceful
Most people started watching tennis to see Federer.
39
21/02/2021 18:58:08 5 1
bbc
"The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style"

In other words, whatever floats your boat. Numbers don't matter, what a specific poster called Cruiser thinks matters a lot.

Got it.
46
21/02/2021 19:40:04 0 0
bbc
Of course numbers matter a lot but it should not be the only criteria. I'm a big fan of RN and ND but if I had a choice to watch all 3 playing a match at the same moment, it would undoubtedly be Federer. It's all skill and raw talent, not like a machine
40
21/02/2021 19:07:19 11 4
bbc
When did this stupid acronym come in? The last thing I would imagine anyone wants to be called is a goat!! Why not G E for greatest ever? Or anything, really, that didn't make the acronym sound like an insult? Who came up with the idiotic thing anyway? The Sun? Sounds just about their level! Anyway....for sheer joy of watching it would be Federer for me, but they are all absolutely brilliant.
48
21/02/2021 19:44:18 20 5
bbc
Federer is the reason many started watching tennis in the first place. Absolute joy...
53
21/02/2021 20:38:08 2 0
bbc
I apologise for my rant. I have looked it up and it seems GoAT originated with Muhammad Ali. In the 90s, his wife coined it for the business.
So I am WAY behind the times and just a grumpy old woman so sorry about that!
I repeat my assertion that all three are brilliant, have brought many many years of entertainment - we are lucky to have had them to keep tennis well in the public eye and popular!
213
22/02/2021 03:24:27 1 1
bbc
Agree, Goat is a very stupid acronym !
41
21/02/2021 19:09:02 9 2
bbc
I’ve been a tennis fan for almost 50 years,and feel privileged to have watched the 3 greatest male players of the Open era.
As with any sport,trying to determine who is the GOAT is highly subjective- it’s not just about statistics.These 3 have elevated the game to an incredibly high level in terms of consistency,athleticism and will to win.
Who would I want to win to save my life? Rafa of course.
37
21/02/2021 18:40:02 2 9
bbc
The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style. Add all these attributes to the titles won and then you get your true goat : FEDERER . He is elegant and graceful
Most people started watching tennis to see Federer.
42
21/02/2021 19:14:58 2 0
bbc
1. Number of slams
2. H2HS
3. Masters
4. Style

Thats how it should be decided
47
21/02/2021 19:42:27 0 2
bbc
Yes, when you consider all 4 and you even give more weight to numbers like grand slams and H2H, it would be Federer as goat. Unless of course ND wins like 30 grand slams, then it's a different story.
14
21/02/2021 17:17:14 5 11
bbc
Federer is no GOAT. He won over half his slams before 2009, against poor competition and nobodys. Just look at the chart in the article. As soon as Rafa and Nole came along Federer was found out.

Had Fed been 10 years younger, he would have been the same as today's crop of 20-somethings: Zverev, Medvedev, Thiem. He would have won at best 2-3 slams.
43
21/02/2021 19:17:36 4 3
bbc
Yes and he won his last three when Djokovic was out injured else he could have been still on 17
52
21/02/2021 20:36:32 1 1
bbc
FED can only play the person in front of him - he wasn't responsible for injuries of the others. He has been in top tier of tennis players since 2003 - his ability is not in question!
44
21/02/2021 19:24:45 22 11
bbc
All three are amazing players, and a privilege to see them at the top of their game. As the most mentally tough, and with the better head to head record against all others, the greatest has to be Djokovic.
45
21/02/2021 19:29:13 8 3
bbc
For sheer beauty, elegance, natural talent and professionalism on and off the Court I would have to say Federer who in my eyes is definitely the GOAT. However, I imagine that Djkovic will end up winning the largest number of tournaments
39
21/02/2021 18:58:08 5 1
bbc
"The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style"

In other words, whatever floats your boat. Numbers don't matter, what a specific poster called Cruiser thinks matters a lot.

Got it.
46
21/02/2021 19:40:04 0 0
bbc
Of course numbers matter a lot but it should not be the only criteria. I'm a big fan of RN and ND but if I had a choice to watch all 3 playing a match at the same moment, it would undoubtedly be Federer. It's all skill and raw talent, not like a machine
42
21/02/2021 19:14:58 2 0
bbc
1. Number of slams
2. H2HS
3. Masters
4. Style

Thats how it should be decided
47
21/02/2021 19:42:27 0 2
bbc
Yes, when you consider all 4 and you even give more weight to numbers like grand slams and H2H, it would be Federer as goat. Unless of course ND wins like 30 grand slams, then it's a different story.
104
22/02/2021 00:05:37 1 2
bbc
So, Djoker who leads Fed H2h, more Masters 1000, more end of the year #1, more weeks at #1, better competition in winning his slams, 4 straight slams (Nole Slam), HAS to win 10 more slams than Federer just to get into the same sentence as Federer.

OK. That makes sense.
40
21/02/2021 19:07:19 11 4
bbc
When did this stupid acronym come in? The last thing I would imagine anyone wants to be called is a goat!! Why not G E for greatest ever? Or anything, really, that didn't make the acronym sound like an insult? Who came up with the idiotic thing anyway? The Sun? Sounds just about their level! Anyway....for sheer joy of watching it would be Federer for me, but they are all absolutely brilliant.
48
21/02/2021 19:44:18 20 5
bbc
Federer is the reason many started watching tennis in the first place. Absolute joy...
49
21/02/2021 19:59:54 5 0
bbc
What about the Olympics?
86
21/02/2021 23:06:01 1 1
bbc
The Olympics field is restricted to 4 per nation, hence in terms of strength more akin to a Masters than a Major. 64 entry.
50
21/02/2021 20:12:03 7 4
bbc
Nadal. No one has dominated a Grand Slam surface like he has clay. Virtually unbeatable. How different the number of ATP Tour Finals tallies would look if they were held on clay....
I also feel Nadal has been unfortunate with injuries, and I think his tally of Grand Slams would be higher again without sustaining so many. Quite frankly though, all three of them are unbelievable!
63
21/02/2021 21:38:56 7 2
bbc
On the other hand if there wasn't a grand slam on clay nadal would have only won 7 slams.
69
21/02/2021 22:00:08 0 3
bbc
Or the opposite view is that Nadal is only up there because of his domination on clay, a surface he grew up on. For this reason I'd put him third
211
22/02/2021 03:22:33 1 0
bbc
All three had injuries to deal with - Nadal is no exception !
300
22/02/2021 07:34:27 0 1
bbc
What if's with clay and saying he's been unfortunate with injuries, the classic Nadal fan type post.

He isn't unfortunate with his injuries, if you pound your body to it's absolute limit like his style of play always has then injuries are inevitable, Murray did that just the once and look what it's done to him.
338
22/02/2021 08:21:12 1 0
bbc
If there was a grand slam or two in water, Rusedski would definitely be in the mix as he’s an excellent snorkeler.
51
21/02/2021 20:32:56 54 9
bbc
FED IMHO - lots will disagree but for a man to be at top of his game for so long - plus he has a lovely game to watch. All people entitled to their own opinion on this - & I cannot deny ND, RN & RF all tremendous players. Plus a lot of earlier players - if they had same knowledge etc as they have today - may well have been better than even these 3 - we will never know!
798
22/02/2021 15:01:25 2 7
bbc
"for a man to be at top of his game for so long"
Fed finished 2001/02/03 at #13/6/2.
#6 doesn't burnish his GOAT claim much. So, take #2. He has been at the top since 2003. Rafa finished 2005 at #2. So, Fed is almost 5 years older than Rafa and got to the top 2 years earlier. Don't see how Roger has been at the top for any longer than them. Novak is soon beating Fed's record at #1 weeks
43
21/02/2021 19:17:36 4 3
bbc
Yes and he won his last three when Djokovic was out injured else he could have been still on 17
52
21/02/2021 20:36:32 1 1
bbc
FED can only play the person in front of him - he wasn't responsible for injuries of the others. He has been in top tier of tennis players since 2003 - his ability is not in question!
40
21/02/2021 19:07:19 11 4
bbc
When did this stupid acronym come in? The last thing I would imagine anyone wants to be called is a goat!! Why not G E for greatest ever? Or anything, really, that didn't make the acronym sound like an insult? Who came up with the idiotic thing anyway? The Sun? Sounds just about their level! Anyway....for sheer joy of watching it would be Federer for me, but they are all absolutely brilliant.
53
21/02/2021 20:38:08 2 0
bbc
I apologise for my rant. I have looked it up and it seems GoAT originated with Muhammad Ali. In the 90s, his wife coined it for the business.
So I am WAY behind the times and just a grumpy old woman so sorry about that!
I repeat my assertion that all three are brilliant, have brought many many years of entertainment - we are lucky to have had them to keep tennis well in the public eye and popular!
54
21/02/2021 20:41:40 0 0
bbc
If I was Connors - I'd be a tad peeved that my name is never mentioned in these debates.
66
21/02/2021 21:54:49 3 0
bbc
Agreed, and so many other players who should be considered in what is at heart a frivolous debate..McEnroe, Borg, Sampras, Laver (I'm too young to remember the last)...the last twenty years with increased professionalism and fitness levels have produced this strange phenomenon of the big three...and it seems no one is yet able to challenge them
68
21/02/2021 21:57:34 1 0
bbc
Why?
85
21/02/2021 23:04:09 0 0
bbc
While Connors never won the French, he was banned from playing there during his prime years due to his affiliation with World Team Tennis.
One of his US Open titles was on clay.
55
21/02/2021 20:42:03 25 5
bbc
Djokovic also held all 4 Grand Slams at the same time on 3 different surfaces. Before him it happened I think more than 50 years ago.
64
Rob
21/02/2021 21:39:28 6 0
bbc
True. Rod Laver in 1969 for his second calendar Grand Slam. He also did it in 1962, and before that, Don Budge got the Grand Slam in 1938 preceded by Wimbledon and Us open in '37 for 6 in a row.
147
22/02/2021 01:11:06 3 1
bbc
It wasn't a calendar slam like Rod Laver achieved twice
152
22/02/2021 01:16:57 0 0
bbc
And Andre Agassi is the only tennis player in history to win all four Grand slams on four different surfaces
502
22/02/2021 10:26:35 2 0
bbc
A huge achivement that hardly ever gets mentioned.
839
22/02/2021 15:50:42 0 0
bbc
I don't understand why they are called Grand Slams unless they are all won in the same year; but that's probably because I know the origin of the term 'Grand Slam' from before tennis hijacked its use and twisted its meaning.
37
21/02/2021 18:40:02 2 9
bbc
The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style. Add all these attributes to the titles won and then you get your true goat : FEDERER . He is elegant and graceful
Most people started watching tennis to see Federer.
56
21/02/2021 20:43:24 1 0
bbc
Firstly, personality has no impact on your tennis ability. Neither does it matter what your playing style is. Federer's playing style may be more aesthetically pleasing that but its about how effective you technique is.
57
21/02/2021 20:46:49 1 2
bbc
RF had 237 consecutive weeks at number 1 - well ahead of any of his rivals. This IMHO is another reason why he is the GOAT.
58
21/02/2021 20:51:05 35 0
bbc
Privileged to have experienced an era when without a shadow of a doubt 3 of Tennis' all time greats have gone h2h for 14+ yrs consistently taking upping their game well into their 30s (not too long ago players were deemed past their prime at 30!) taking us all on a journey to cherish for a life time and they aren't done yet! Can we reserve GOAT judgement till the time all 3 have hung their boots?
203
22/02/2021 03:10:26 32 49
bbc
Ona side note, remember when people legit thought Andy Murray was on the same level as these 3? Haha
207
22/02/2021 03:17:15 1 1
bbc
Here here well said piyush,theirs no beating around the bush.piyush
59
21/02/2021 21:21:42 15 8
bbc
All three are clearly brilliant, but no one has had a period of sustained dominance like Federer. 17 grand slam finals out of 18. 23 consecutive grand slam semis. World number 1 for 237 weeks in a row. And I believe his best tennis, when he was at his peak, beats Djokovic's best, and Nadal's when not on clay.
91
21/02/2021 23:18:40 9 8
bbc
In Enter the Dragon, Bruce Lee says to O'Hara "boards don't hit back"

Point: one's best is decided by how the other bloke returns.

Medvedev was looking like a world beater till Semis, then crashed in straight sets to Novak in the final.

Roger's best looked sweet, poetic and awesome v Baghdatis, Roddick and Hewitt. When he plays Novak and Rafa, errors creep in. Many errors.
506
22/02/2021 10:28:31 1 1
bbc
To me it's far more impressive that Novak came onto the tour being dominated by Rafa & Roger, and has been able to surpass their level and almost catch their slam counts. Roger dominated from 2003-2008 but he didn't have much competition outside of Rafa at Roland Garros.
34
21/02/2021 18:02:04 78 167
bbc
Djokovic beat Federer 3 times at Wimby, twice in finals. Federer beat him at Wimby ONCE.

Federer won his 5 Wimbys in 2003-07, before Djoker even came out of teens. Fairly weak period for tennis in those days. He also sneaked in one Wimby in 2017 when Djoker was dealing with injury.
60
21/02/2021 21:21:59 22 20
bbc
It's a fair point but Djoker and Nadal are also significantly younger than Federer, however Nadal was able to regularly beat Federer in his prime. Federer possibly has the most stylish form of play but overall Djokovic and Nadal are in my opinion a level above Federer.
88
21/02/2021 23:13:52 1 66
bbc
When exactly was Federer prime? When he was winning? Like 2003 to 2007, 2012 Wimby, 2017 AO and Wimby and 2018 AO and so on?

Nadal did Federer as he was dominant on clay from the beginning. Djoker won AO in 2008, and was just 20. So, Novak did not slams in teens. Neither did Fed.

" Federer possibly has the most stylish form of play " - Ok. Thanks for that editorial.
61
21/02/2021 21:25:18 3 0
bbc
Too early to tell who will end up on top. I suspect if RN is top or joint top in terms of Slams he will be curiously marked down for the crime of dominating RG. Not his fault though! ND in the best position right now in terms of years left and more tread left on the tyres. But he has to translate that into titles.
62
21/02/2021 21:27:37 9 2
bbc
The stats on balance suggest Federer is the most balanced. But the most just verdict would be for best: Nadal Clay, Federer Grass and Djokovic Hardcourt! A truly truly wonderful conclusion.

I think Medvedev will turn into a monster and don't think the big 3 will win many more GS: But equally none will match their combined records for a long time.
206
22/02/2021 03:16:56 3 0
bbc
At this moment no one can tell how the 'new crop' of players will turn out in the long run ! While the (aging) top three have proven their amazing longevity - the next generation has still to do so ! And it may still be a while until they do - and who will turn out to be the best !
511
22/02/2021 10:31:53 1 0
bbc
Federer is not better on grass than Novak. Three Wimbledon finals between them and Novak has won the lot.
50
21/02/2021 20:12:03 7 4
bbc
Nadal. No one has dominated a Grand Slam surface like he has clay. Virtually unbeatable. How different the number of ATP Tour Finals tallies would look if they were held on clay....
I also feel Nadal has been unfortunate with injuries, and I think his tally of Grand Slams would be higher again without sustaining so many. Quite frankly though, all three of them are unbelievable!
63
21/02/2021 21:38:56 7 2
bbc
On the other hand if there wasn't a grand slam on clay nadal would have only won 7 slams.
113
22/02/2021 00:29:10 4 0
bbc
And if there wasn't an Australian Open, Djokovic would 'only' have 8 slams, if there wasn't Wimbledon then a previous GOAT contender Sampras would 'only' have 7. This comes up so often about Nadal and French but if you're going to take away his best slam then use the 'only' argument, you have to do the same for others. Even with the stupid 'lets remove the French', he's still a GOAT contender.
301
22/02/2021 07:35:10 1 0
bbc
If there wasn't a grand slam on hard court, Novak would have only 6 slams, silly argument Nadal has only 7 slams away from clay
456
22/02/2021 09:52:33 1 0
bbc
At the same time, imagine if there were 2 clay grand slams? (Like there are 2 hard grand slams) .. Nadal would be on 30+ by now. Clay is a perfectly fine surface in tennis and suits Nadals game just like hard suits ND.
642
22/02/2021 12:23:05 0 0
bbc
Jacob ........
ITS CALLED JEALOUSY
55
21/02/2021 20:42:03 25 5
bbc
Djokovic also held all 4 Grand Slams at the same time on 3 different surfaces. Before him it happened I think more than 50 years ago.
64
Rob
21/02/2021 21:39:28 6 0
bbc
True. Rod Laver in 1969 for his second calendar Grand Slam. He also did it in 1962, and before that, Don Budge got the Grand Slam in 1938 preceded by Wimbledon and Us open in '37 for 6 in a row.
462
22/02/2021 09:57:04 0 0
bbc
You could argue that of he hadn't lost the years he did Laver would have been on 20+ slams. I think this era has been fortunate in having the 3 for so long, bit each benefit from massive advances in sports science, surgery, medicine, nutrition and the financial rewards in sport these days that have seen most sports populated with competitors able play and win at much greater ages than previously.
65
21/02/2021 21:45:20 4 3
bbc
Federer is the GOAT he was unstoppable during 2003-2010 no one could beat him it was the way he played which lead him to become of the one of the best of all time and he has the most titles out of everyone who is active and Federer has a massive chance of winning at least one more GS at wimbledon but he has got too perform to his absolute best
854
22/02/2021 16:18:46 0 0
bbc
Thinking of real goats, I wonder whom I could proclaim to be the “top” goat, the one that climbs the higher spot on the mountain or the one whose style I find the most attractive?
54
21/02/2021 20:41:40 0 0
bbc
If I was Connors - I'd be a tad peeved that my name is never mentioned in these debates.
66
21/02/2021 21:54:49 3 0
bbc
Agreed, and so many other players who should be considered in what is at heart a frivolous debate..McEnroe, Borg, Sampras, Laver (I'm too young to remember the last)...the last twenty years with increased professionalism and fitness levels have produced this strange phenomenon of the big three...and it seems no one is yet able to challenge them
67
21/02/2021 21:57:18 158 32
bbc
Which of them would you tell your grand-children that you saw them play? Federer for me
98
21/02/2021 23:55:13 43 120
bbc
What will you tell them? That you saw Federer play - play who? Nadal and Djokovic? Or if you think it is not worth mentioning those two, then you will telh them that you saw Fed beating Baghdatis/Roddick?

I will tell them I saw Djoker beating the great Federer, I saw Rafa beating the great Federer, that I saw Djoker beating the great Nadal more than the great Nadal beating the not so great Djoker
204
22/02/2021 03:10:50 1 0
bbc
That's a matter of individual taste and liking ! All three are Great !
402
22/02/2021 09:15:23 3 2
bbc
I think this is what holds Djokovic back- Federer plays with an almost balletic grace, Nadal is a raging bull whereas Djokovic is almost boringly perfect. Its like when Mourinho's Chelsea were in their pomp- in the mid to late noughtied they were one of the best in the world, comprehensively dethroning the invincibles, yet (unfairly) noone remembers them as greats.
486
22/02/2021 10:19:30 0 0
bbc
Yes especially if he was playing Nadal
523
22/02/2021 10:42:52 3 6
bbc
Federer. All other things being equal, Federer is the one I would choose as a role model for my son. Joker a deceiving insecure robot, Nadal not so bad in truth, neither the class of Federer .
848
22/02/2021 16:01:54 3 0
bbc
What are you going to say to your grand-child. "Look here is a video of Federer playing one of his greatest rivals. Federer was the GOAT."
"Then why is he getting beat Grandad Dave?"
928
22/02/2021 18:38:39 0 0
bbc
djoko beating fed
965
22/02/2021 19:17:06 0 0
bbc
Nadal
994
22/02/2021 19:46:21 0 0
bbc
Murray . British
998
22/02/2021 19:51:40 0 0
bbc
I’m sure that depends who you are, where are you coming from and where your sympathies lie :) And telling them of Fed will not be wrong for sure. Fantastic player that has brought another level to the sport. But then I would prefer a story of a nobody, from an obscure and troubled place and no local or regional tennis association/federation support to come through and despite all that get here.
54
21/02/2021 20:41:40 0 0
bbc
If I was Connors - I'd be a tad peeved that my name is never mentioned in these debates.
68
21/02/2021 21:57:34 1 0
bbc
Why?
50
21/02/2021 20:12:03 7 4
bbc
Nadal. No one has dominated a Grand Slam surface like he has clay. Virtually unbeatable. How different the number of ATP Tour Finals tallies would look if they were held on clay....
I also feel Nadal has been unfortunate with injuries, and I think his tally of Grand Slams would be higher again without sustaining so many. Quite frankly though, all three of them are unbelievable!
69
21/02/2021 22:00:08 0 3
bbc
Or the opposite view is that Nadal is only up there because of his domination on clay, a surface he grew up on. For this reason I'd put him third
70
21/02/2021 22:00:36 3 0
bbc
Nothing like a tennis GOAT discussion to divide opinion and prove how pointless it is. Even when retired the stats will only show who finished with more titles. They have all been a joy to watch and continue to defy the odds by keeping the next generation at bay. Whether Federer continues to compete after such a lay off is something to look forward to this year.
37
21/02/2021 18:40:02 2 9
bbc
The number of grand slams won while being a good measure is not the only measure to identify the goat. There are more attributes to be considered such as personality, character, sportsmanship, role model and when playing style. Add all these attributes to the titles won and then you get your true goat : FEDERER . He is elegant and graceful
Most people started watching tennis to see Federer.
71
21/02/2021 22:01:06 0 1
bbc
Only real measure who is better between two players is H2H(with enough matches).How can Federer or Nadal be considered GOAT if they both have negative H2H against Djokovic?Number of slams,masters and all other titles can only be used to compare players who play in different times.If we use number of titles to measure players who have H2H we can only see who is a better achiever and not GOAT.
72
21/02/2021 22:10:03 2 2
bbc
McEnroe
73
21/02/2021 22:11:50 32 22
bbc
Djokovic is the GOAT. He has a winning record over the other two, most Masters titles, most weeks at number 1 in the world, and could possibly end up with the most majors, too.

Federer, whilst world class, benefited from winning most of his majors during a comparatively weak era.

Nadal is not as well-rounded as the other two, but still phenomenal. Too dominant on clay.
141
22/02/2021 01:05:25 11 10
bbc
And is younger. Fed is the GOAT.
145
22/02/2021 01:07:23 3 1
bbc
I think most of Federers Grand slam wins came against opponents like Hewitt, Roddick and Safin. He dont have a winning record in slams against Nadal and Djokovic
295
22/02/2021 07:23:41 0 0
bbc
Reckon you can argue he is the best of the three, but a true goat would be clearly the GOAT.

Not in a competition with other great players.
74
21/02/2021 22:12:39 1 9
bbc
Novak 'Interesting' Djokovic is so dull it's difficult to think of him as greatest anything.
229
22/02/2021 04:02:38 0 0
bbc
Djokovic dull ! - Obviously you have not seen him impersonating other players !
1
21/02/2021 16:17:09 20 6
bbc
Surely Djokovic will ultimately win the most. He is a machine and the competition is weak: most opponents are beaten before they take the court.
75
21/02/2021 22:18:16 11 8
bbc
Realy?Djokovic has weak opponents?If that is case he is GOAT because Nadal nad Federer are weak opponents...
99
21/02/2021 23:55:25 6 4
bbc
Can we also have a comparison of which player takes he most injury time out when trailing ?
239
22/02/2021 04:31:11 3 4
bbc
Federer's age and in decline for a few years now and nadal has been prone to injury and djokovic feins injury for gamesmanship so yes not the depth of good players around like before.
76
21/02/2021 22:18:45 0 5
bbc
Murray has beaten each multiple times, therefore is GOAT
96
21/02/2021 23:53:28 0 0
bbc
Really? Murray has only won three Grand Slams.
28
21/02/2021 17:41:46 9 15
bbc
Many of Wimby crowd is racist. The same is reflected in HYS. The hatred to Serena is disgraceful. A similar attitude is shown to Djokovic. But these two are the very best of all time, bar none.

Hopefully Osaka will challenge Serena's slam total. She is an amazing young lady. Inspiring. No doubt WImby crowds will be hostile to Osaka too (obvious reason, something to do with skin and all that)
77
21/02/2021 22:20:43 8 0
bbc
A lot of tennis fans I have spoken to have disliked Serena and Djokovic. I don't believe it is anything to do with racism, but more about how they come across both on court and in interviews . Nor do I believe Wimbledon crowds are racist. They will embrace Naomi Osaka just as they did Venus Williams, Zina Garrison etc
135
22/02/2021 00:57:28 0 4
bbc
Don’t be naive Dave- it is racism
78
21/02/2021 22:24:53 2 4
bbc
Depends what the G stands for , if it’s Gobsh.te...then yes he is the clear winner.
763
22/02/2021 14:28:53 0 0
bbc
Banter.
79
21/02/2021 22:25:01 0 1
bbc
Roy Emerson was the goat before Sampras....just saying..And respect to Roy Emerson if any of his family and friends are reading this! You were the goat!
87
21/02/2021 23:09:30 0 0
bbc
You mean when he won all those titles because Laver, Rosewall et al were banned for turning pro?
80
21/02/2021 22:38:24 7 5
bbc
Interesting that the author didn't find it relevant that Novak was the first and only singles player to hold all four major titles at once in the tennis Open Era.
162
22/02/2021 01:36:36 3 4
bbc
And that Novak is the only player ever to win All 9 Masters 1000 events . Facts are facts, no 'alternative facts' here please. Novak is the GOAT.
81
21/02/2021 22:55:23 3 6
bbc
Wake up you minority fools who don't accept that the GOAT is determined by the highest tally of Grand Slams. All endeavours are judged by the result. If the result of someone's tennis career is the highest number of Grand Slam titles then that person must be the greatest. Is it not? I hope the fools pedaling some other criteria for determining the GOAT will wake up and shut up.
130
22/02/2021 00:55:18 0 0
bbc
Sport is much more than just numbers and figures. Why take out the artistry and beauty of tennis. Who would want to watch some machine play.
223
22/02/2021 03:56:33 0 0
bbc
No need to call people fools for having their own likes and favourites ! Maybe YOU should shut up ! ?
7
21/02/2021 16:39:55 34 21
bbc
Djokovic is GOAT at the moment. Then Federer and Nadal comes to third. Federer won at least 5-6 Grandslams when there was not big names in early 2000 after retirement of Agassi and Sampras. Djokovic and Nadal won during the most competitive time period. However, Nadal did not win more on different surfaces compared to Djokovic. Djokovic is leading head to head to all leading players.
82
21/02/2021 22:55:26 2 2
bbc
In fact Federer only played against Sampras once - he beat him at Wimbledon. That was more or less that for Pistol Pete.
195
22/02/2021 02:42:49 2 0
bbc
So, Fed beat Samp 2001, only match they played. Who was defending wimb champ? Oh that’s right Samps, that was more or less that for Samps? Who won US Open in 2002 lol more or less huh
28
21/02/2021 17:41:46 9 15
bbc
Many of Wimby crowd is racist. The same is reflected in HYS. The hatred to Serena is disgraceful. A similar attitude is shown to Djokovic. But these two are the very best of all time, bar none.

Hopefully Osaka will challenge Serena's slam total. She is an amazing young lady. Inspiring. No doubt WImby crowds will be hostile to Osaka too (obvious reason, something to do with skin and all that)
83
21/02/2021 23:00:19 2 0
bbc
Have to disagree with you on two counts. I can't see that crowd turning on Osaka - they never have on Serena or Venus. They hate Novak because of what he's done to (swoon) Roger. And it remains to be seen how dominant she will be. Matching Williams S will take some doing.
6
21/02/2021 16:38:18 72 8
bbc
Suspect this is just to give you folks something to bite on. Imagine if Borg had played into his middle thirties rather than quitting at 26? His win GS to appearances percentage is better than all 3 and remember he did not play Paris in for a couple of years in late 70s. Discussion is just bogus!
84
21/02/2021 23:02:34 2 1
bbc
Used to love watching Borg but sad to say he was a quitter.
54
21/02/2021 20:41:40 0 0
bbc
If I was Connors - I'd be a tad peeved that my name is never mentioned in these debates.
85
21/02/2021 23:04:09 0 0
bbc
While Connors never won the French, he was banned from playing there during his prime years due to his affiliation with World Team Tennis.
One of his US Open titles was on clay.
49
21/02/2021 19:59:54 5 0
bbc
What about the Olympics?
86
21/02/2021 23:06:01 1 1
bbc
The Olympics field is restricted to 4 per nation, hence in terms of strength more akin to a Masters than a Major. 64 entry.
286
22/02/2021 07:11:58 1 0
bbc
And yet is considered to be on a level with the 4 majors. Hence Novak's tears at being knocked out in Rio 2016. He also lost to Del Potro in 2012. Federer is well quoted as being very disappointed at not winning singles gold. Only Nadal from the so called 'big 3' has a singles gold.
79
21/02/2021 22:25:01 0 1
bbc
Roy Emerson was the goat before Sampras....just saying..And respect to Roy Emerson if any of his family and friends are reading this! You were the goat!
87
21/02/2021 23:09:30 0 0
bbc
You mean when he won all those titles because Laver, Rosewall et al were banned for turning pro?
60
21/02/2021 21:21:59 22 20
bbc
It's a fair point but Djoker and Nadal are also significantly younger than Federer, however Nadal was able to regularly beat Federer in his prime. Federer possibly has the most stylish form of play but overall Djokovic and Nadal are in my opinion a level above Federer.
88
21/02/2021 23:13:52 1 66
bbc
When exactly was Federer prime? When he was winning? Like 2003 to 2007, 2012 Wimby, 2017 AO and Wimby and 2018 AO and so on?

Nadal did Federer as he was dominant on clay from the beginning. Djoker won AO in 2008, and was just 20. So, Novak did not slams in teens. Neither did Fed.

" Federer possibly has the most stylish form of play " - Ok. Thanks for that editorial.
143
22/02/2021 01:06:52 33 7
bbc
What? And you are? Exactly a nobody. Thanks for the pointless info
89
21/02/2021 23:14:44 0 0
bbc
Anyone know when, how or if they're going to sort out the ranking points? Seems they can still hang on to 2019 points, but for how much longer?
90
21/02/2021 23:14:46 60 18
bbc
Federer has the most artistry.
Nadal's forehand is groundbreaking, no one can duplicate it.
Djokovic just does everything really well. He has such an entertaining personality and his impersonations of other players are legendary. One of my favorite tennis moments happened when Djokovic was impersonating McEnroe, who left the booth and the two played a point with Djokovic pretending to be McEnroe.
92
21/02/2021 23:34:27 18 8
bbc
Jack Sock could generate similar spin to Nadal with his FH.

It shows you how much modern racket technology can do when Sock has always had poor fitness, defence and BH yet still got to the top 10 + won a Masters event with little but that heavy topspin FH + a good serve.

People massively underestimate or refuse to believe how much of an effect the advancement in strings has on Nadal's game.
93
21/02/2021 23:40:35 6 1
bbc
and Sharapova! - still available on YouTube. The crowd liked that playful version of Novak - it was only when he showed his steely side and they realised he was a threat to their (swoon) Roger that they turned against him.
424
22/02/2021 09:26:56 2 0
bbc
So glad you mentioned this as I used to really enjoy joy these too!

As did the players.

Then the media jumped on it saying he was being disrespectful and rude doing impressions. He duly stopped.....this was the begging of a media witch-hunt.
625
Ray
22/02/2021 12:02:38 2 1
bbc
Djokovic has an entertaining personality? I personally find it cringeworthy most of the time.
59
21/02/2021 21:21:42 15 8
bbc
All three are clearly brilliant, but no one has had a period of sustained dominance like Federer. 17 grand slam finals out of 18. 23 consecutive grand slam semis. World number 1 for 237 weeks in a row. And I believe his best tennis, when he was at his peak, beats Djokovic's best, and Nadal's when not on clay.
91
21/02/2021 23:18:40 9 8
bbc
In Enter the Dragon, Bruce Lee says to O'Hara "boards don't hit back"

Point: one's best is decided by how the other bloke returns.

Medvedev was looking like a world beater till Semis, then crashed in straight sets to Novak in the final.

Roger's best looked sweet, poetic and awesome v Baghdatis, Roddick and Hewitt. When he plays Novak and Rafa, errors creep in. Many errors.
133
22/02/2021 00:56:46 5 5
bbc
When Djokovic starts to lose he feigns injury like he did against Andy Murray in an Australian open final a few years ago. Then all of a sudden he makes a miraculous recovery during the match.
Fed has nothing to prove to trolls like you who post utter drivel!
980
22/02/2021 19:29:11 1 0
bbc
Djokovic is six years younger than Fed. A younger player will some day have a winning record over Djokovic. It's normal. At his advanced age Fed is still a problem for Djokovic. Fed beat him at the 2019 tour finals, and should have beaten him at Wimbledon 2019. I know Djokovic actually won that match, but Fed won more points, so Djokovic made more errors than Federer, to contradict your point.
90
21/02/2021 23:14:46 60 18
bbc
Federer has the most artistry.
Nadal's forehand is groundbreaking, no one can duplicate it.
Djokovic just does everything really well. He has such an entertaining personality and his impersonations of other players are legendary. One of my favorite tennis moments happened when Djokovic was impersonating McEnroe, who left the booth and the two played a point with Djokovic pretending to be McEnroe.
92
21/02/2021 23:34:27 18 8
bbc
Jack Sock could generate similar spin to Nadal with his FH.

It shows you how much modern racket technology can do when Sock has always had poor fitness, defence and BH yet still got to the top 10 + won a Masters event with little but that heavy topspin FH + a good serve.

People massively underestimate or refuse to believe how much of an effect the advancement in strings has on Nadal's game.
95
21/02/2021 23:51:52 3 0
bbc
Spot on. His success is hugely affected by new string tech. Of the three Nadal would have to change his game the most to play with previous racket tech and court speeds
105
22/02/2021 00:06:39 5 2
bbc
For me it must be recognised that Federer's best surface is a FAST court and NOT ONE slam is rated fast. US Open is rated as slower than some clay courts now. Wimbledon is rated medium now and AO medium fast. Imagine how different the stats would be if even one GS was still played on a fast court surface.
22/02/2021 23:43:14 0 0
bbc
Agree, give Rafa a Dunlop Max Ply with gut strings - with a Rod Laver or John Newcombe with a point to prove on a sun baked Aussie grass court.
90
21/02/2021 23:14:46 60 18
bbc
Federer has the most artistry.
Nadal's forehand is groundbreaking, no one can duplicate it.
Djokovic just does everything really well. He has such an entertaining personality and his impersonations of other players are legendary. One of my favorite tennis moments happened when Djokovic was impersonating McEnroe, who left the booth and the two played a point with Djokovic pretending to be McEnroe.
93
21/02/2021 23:40:35 6 1
bbc
and Sharapova! - still available on YouTube. The crowd liked that playful version of Novak - it was only when he showed his steely side and they realised he was a threat to their (swoon) Roger that they turned against him.
94
21/02/2021 23:47:15 1 0
bbc
Too difficult to say who's the GOAT as all three players have no apparent weaknesses. However, this era of tennis has to be the GOAT. Certainly the best I've witnessed and I don't think they'll be one quite like it ever again.
92
21/02/2021 23:34:27 18 8
bbc
Jack Sock could generate similar spin to Nadal with his FH.

It shows you how much modern racket technology can do when Sock has always had poor fitness, defence and BH yet still got to the top 10 + won a Masters event with little but that heavy topspin FH + a good serve.

People massively underestimate or refuse to believe how much of an effect the advancement in strings has on Nadal's game.
95
21/02/2021 23:51:52 3 0
bbc
Spot on. His success is hugely affected by new string tech. Of the three Nadal would have to change his game the most to play with previous racket tech and court speeds
76
21/02/2021 22:18:45 0 5
bbc
Murray has beaten each multiple times, therefore is GOAT
96
21/02/2021 23:53:28 0 0
bbc
Really? Murray has only won three Grand Slams.
762
22/02/2021 14:28:38 0 0
bbc
Clearly you can’t count...
97
21/02/2021 23:55:10 4 4
bbc
Sampras was a very overrated player in my opinion. Played in a poor era and was all about the serve and volley. Agassi worked him out.
107
22/02/2021 00:09:18 4 0
bbc
Actually Sampras beat him most of the time so Agassi didnt work him out too well
256
22/02/2021 06:21:54 0 0
bbc
Give me a break. Best first serve, best second serve, best volleys, best overhead, best running forehand of all-time. Arguably much greater than Djokovic and certainly much more entertaining and inspiring to watch.
67
21/02/2021 21:57:18 158 32
bbc
Which of them would you tell your grand-children that you saw them play? Federer for me
98
21/02/2021 23:55:13 43 120
bbc
What will you tell them? That you saw Federer play - play who? Nadal and Djokovic? Or if you think it is not worth mentioning those two, then you will telh them that you saw Fed beating Baghdatis/Roddick?

I will tell them I saw Djoker beating the great Federer, I saw Rafa beating the great Federer, that I saw Djoker beating the great Nadal more than the great Nadal beating the not so great Djoker
115
22/02/2021 00:35:02 20 7
bbc
There is more to Tennis than results. The sheer poetry of the Fed forehand, his conduct on the court, his humility off it; all of these, in addition to the results, have contributed to making Tennis a greater sport. Fed is an artist on the court, a poet with his racquet. To play with such elegance and win is talent at its pinnacle. We are privileged to see it in action.
317
22/02/2021 07:55:39 15 0
bbc
Dave was only stating his opinion on a personal preference. You don't have to second guess what he shares with his grandkids to make your opinion any more meaningful to your grandkids.

Although, I have a feeling from your posts on here, you'll be showing them photos of Federer and shaking your fists at it while hyperventilating.
318
22/02/2021 07:56:47 14 2
bbc
Federer was coming through and having to beat the likes of Sampras & Agassi... then Hewitt, Roddick, Nalbandian... and now Nadal, Djok, Murray....

He's seen of the best part of 3 generations - and this current one (outside of the big 3) are by far the weakest. For some one with such strong opinions, your level of knowledge seems to be pretty poor.
481
22/02/2021 10:13:44 4 1
bbc
The thing is Federer set the benchmark and could only beat who was in front of him. He led Nadal and Djokovic to the heights they had to go to. Being a frontrunner in anything is so much tougher as its only you setting the standards. I don't think the other two would have been nearly as dominant now if it wasn't for him and he still managed to compete when most would be retiring.
490
22/02/2021 10:20:11 3 0
bbc
What's wrong Kate? That's a few comments that have triggered you now...
534
22/02/2021 10:47:01 0 1
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Blatant troll
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22/02/2021 11:41:28 1 0
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I'll tell them that I witnessed the era of tennis titans an there battles pushed each one to greater heights.
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21/02/2021 22:18:16 11 8
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Realy?Djokovic has weak opponents?If that is case he is GOAT because Nadal nad Federer are weak opponents...
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21/02/2021 23:55:25 6 4
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Can we also have a comparison of which player takes he most injury time out when trailing ?
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22/02/2021 11:28:44 0 0
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EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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21/02/2021 17:19:17 5 6
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Yep, that's Federer for you.
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21/02/2021 23:56:55 1 0
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Joker injure when he trails. Yep. Rent free in your head