Moderna vaccine appears to work against variants
25/01/2021
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news
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health
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Laboratory tests suggest antibodies can recognise and fight the UK and South Africa variants.
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Demonic
25/01/2021 14:52:41
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bbc
Great news. I hope they all work.
Great it works.....but then they roll back with a ' booster ' comment, and not given a percent of how much it works.......
Let's hope if anything good comes from 2020/2021, it's restoring the position that science and progress should occupy in our society. All of the best news I've read for months has come from scientists.
Hmm... some scientists such as researchers helping with vaccines. But we should be careful to generalise. The scientists on SAGE have made mistake after mistake regarding travel into the UK, community testing, face coverings etc.
Yes that's absolutely true incarnia. Science will save us. Respect
of course it won't
the masked singer will make more in phone-in votes in one series than laboratary funding will make
the masked singer will make more in phone-in votes in one series than laboratary funding will make
I agree, but would extend that sentiment to thinking rationally - and about others - in general. Take the story the BBC carried a couple of days ago about a group of young people who would gather in large groups because "they'd already caught the virus and so developed immunity". Immunity isn't a shield against catching - and spreading - the virus again, it only mitigates the symptoms.
So lets stop paying 'celebrities' these huge salaries and start paying decent salaries to proper jobs like life saving scientists, doctors and nurses and other professions that contribute positively to society. Too many people wrapped up on who is wearing what made by someone or what make up brand is in fashion - who cares about that stuff!
I think I say this every time, but the average bench analyst in CROs testing these things gets £23k. The mid-ranking scientists (who are now usually expected to double as study managers too now) get £28k. Senior scientists and post docs get £32k. These wages have actually dropped over the last 10 years, and we are still expected to live on them in Cambridge and Oxford.
It's an absolute disgrace.
It's an absolute disgrace.
The same scientists that are keeping us locked down like some sort of social experiment
Hear Hear....People can pray to any God or Gods or Saints they like, but it will do nothing to stop a virus or bacterium. If you doubt that, just look at some history. Fourteenth Century Europe was far more religious than it is today, but it did not stop the Black Death from wiping out at least a third of the population. It didn't matter whether you were personally devout or a complete libertine.
But wasn't The Virus created and released by scientists? Computer science gave us brilliant computers. It also created some of the world's worst villains.
Science gave us the aeroplane, which gave us the means to spread the virus... it gave us pollutants, toxins and the nuclear bomb. It gave us a generation that is almost totally reliant on computer technology.
Science is meant to enhance life IF USED IN A MORAL, RESPONSIBLE WAY.
HUMANITY, not science, is what society should be concentrating on.
Science is meant to enhance life IF USED IN A MORAL, RESPONSIBLE WAY.
HUMANITY, not science, is what society should be concentrating on.
I hope henceforth people respect scientists instead of complaining about how much they are paid, very few citizens could perform this role with the appropriate level of sagacity or succeed in the selection process - academic rigour of a PHD higher degree in science.
No, let's hope if anything good comes from 2020/21 it's how humans should treat animals with respect.
Though scientists and science should be applauded and show business heroes seen as just entertainers the responsibility for the problems of society should be laid with the voters. In democracies it is not politicians who are to blame they just do what their leaders the voters insist upon; or else. The ordinary people should be put on the spot more often despite their dislike, even terror, of it.
The vaccine is no doubt the best news from scientists but since the daily briefings from Downing Street started last year all the scientists have done is to find ways to keep us in one form of lockdown or another until the vaccine came.
Well thank goodness for that. Now we have the vaccines, lets focus on building effective treatments against the virus with anti-viral research
Also research into antibiotics. In the next 50 years antibiotic resistance could shadow Covid-19 in terms of deaths and a global catastrophe.
Better to catch up on treating all those people suffering from other conditions which have been put on the back burner over the last year.
Realistically, we're unable to do much about viral infections.
Best we can manage are vaccines, stalling treatments and plasma transfusions.
None of which are actual cures or particularly reliable in the long term.
A key disturbing example is that HIV may eventually become a death sentence once again as viruses also develop drug resistance, albeit slower than bacteria.
Best we can manage are vaccines, stalling treatments and plasma transfusions.
None of which are actual cures or particularly reliable in the long term.
A key disturbing example is that HIV may eventually become a death sentence once again as viruses also develop drug resistance, albeit slower than bacteria.
Great news. We need to get the levels down and get everyone vaccinated.
You are aware, I assume, that using the government's preferred indicator, more than 10,000 people have died of any cause within 28 days of a covid vaccination. Sleep well.
Is that “get everyone vaccinated “ by force? Or would you allow people the freedom to make their own choices?
Surely it''s the other way around - get everyone vaccinated THEN the levels come down
They are obviously not that different, which is good news for all of us. Let’s get on jabbing
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Because it is more infectious maybe?
Remember when the North had high numbers it was poor education and poverty. When the south got it it was a new variant.
Makes you wonder why remoaners are so keen to stress that Boris is solely to blame for of life's ills mind...
Good news.
They are obviously not that different, which is good news for all of us. Let’s get on jabbing
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Or could it be that they want lockdown to be in place for as long as ever possible? Lockdown is perhaps the easiest way for politicians of questionable ability to govern a country?
What the BBC neglect to mention here (unbelievably) is that Moderna themselves have said that their vaccination shows a 'six-fold' reduction in effectiveness against the South African strain. They just think it will still provide some benefit against it still. People meeting even in national lockdown will be responsible for vaccines being undermined by a new mutation and longer restrictions.
And that’s the angle Sky has gone with. It’s a totally different story on Skynews.
I agree that they haven't reported these results with enough nuance as it relates to the South African variant. Although I would say that in vivo the effects are highly unlikely to be as much as six times diminished because neutralising antibodies are not the only immune proteins activated by vaccination. There is also the role of T-Cells, complement, non and broadly neutralising antibodies etc.
They are obviously not that different, which is good news for all of us. Let’s get on jabbing
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
But will the government use of the moderna vaccine be in accordance with the laboratory tests
Some good news at last. Let's get everyone vaccinated as soon as possible and put this nightmare behind us.
Note the word/phrase "appears to work".
It doesn't say that it absolutely will, as with all vaccines there's no 100% guarantee that it will.
It doesn't say that it absolutely will, as with all vaccines there's no 100% guarantee that it will.
So they say it ' appears ' to work......then it sort of steps that back by talking about a booster........to what level does it work? What percent. I know that fools tend to rush in where others......so get the facts before shouting!
That's great news!
Now all we need is a Government that works effectively for all scenarios.
Now all we need is a Government that works effectively for all scenarios.
You mean like a government that has delivered over 6 million vaccines in a short space of time? That kind of government?
Great news and well done to the NHS for getting the vaccination program operational whilst under the incredible pressure of helping those with covid
And let's hope there is no repeat of the 2005 Sars-Cov1 trial which was abandoned when a high proportion of the experimental ferrets dropped down dead. They are using the same mRNA antibody dependent enhancement techniques.
Fingers crossed. Removed
Fingers crossed. Removed
YES ,,, BUT THE VACINE!! SHOULD HAVE GONE FIRSTLY TO Drs,Nurses,CLEANERS/PORTERS ..IN HOSPITALS.. THEN TO ALL OLD AGE HOME STAFF,,(Carers ,etc),,then to the older folks,, as the medical mob in general would then be able to do the job of caring better,, being protected,, and less off work causing overloading???
They are obviously not that different, which is good news for all of us. Let’s get on jabbing
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
If you don't know by now 'jude nelson' just refreshes the BBC homepage all day waiting for HYS articles to open up.
They then post whatever they think will get the most upvotes. It doesn't matter if it conflicts with their previous posts either (like this one does), it is only votes that matters.
They then post whatever they think will get the most upvotes. It doesn't matter if it conflicts with their previous posts either (like this one does), it is only votes that matters.
We have yet to find any strain or variant that is completely vaccine-resistant, and I hope we never do.
hooray! with a bit of luck rather than skill we are able to save humanity
Oh dear so Hancocks and the BBC's attempt to scare the bejesus out of the population again yesterday with another 'emerging' variant has just fallen flat.
Hancock is a wally but how on earth are the BBC 'attempting to scare the population'?
No you are wrong. Hancock was talking about the Brazillian variant. This article mentions the UK and South African variants only, which Pfizer and AstraZeneca have already said 'should' be contained by the current vaccines. There have also been other studies showing the Pfizer vaccine 'should' work against the UK and South African variant, but the Brazil variant showed resistance.
Note the word/phrase "appears to work".
It doesn't say that it absolutely will, as with all vaccines there's no 100% guarantee that it will.
It doesn't say that it absolutely will, as with all vaccines there's no 100% guarantee that it will.
Not at all just being a realist.
I don't want to see people's hopes raised, only to get them dashed at the last moment.
I don't want to see people's hopes raised, only to get them dashed at the last moment.
There has been a great deal of silence about new variants from Astrazeneca. Both Pfgizer and Moderna have said they can tweak their vaccines - nothing from AZ. Given that AZ's efficacy is also lower than the other two have we been sold a pup just because it is UK developed and cheaper?
Fake news. AZ/Oxford said even before variants came about that they can tweak it in a matter of weeks.
Variants are of no surprise to these vaccine makers.
Variants are of no surprise to these vaccine makers.
People on here are moaning about this early release of information about the Moderna vaccine, whilst others complain about the silence from the other 2 camps. They just can't win.
However, I've no doubt whatsoever that the Pfizer and Oxford scientists are beavering away looking at the new variants and if necessary tweaking the vaccines to cope with them. Or do you think they're now just relaxing?
However, I've no doubt whatsoever that the Pfizer and Oxford scientists are beavering away looking at the new variants and if necessary tweaking the vaccines to cope with them. Or do you think they're now just relaxing?
Yes, good news, but we cannot relax. All sporting events should be cancelled as so much of the virus is being spread as hundreds of people involved with football, horse racing etc. are travelling and mixing with each other every day .
Evidence?
All sporting events should be cancelled anyway cos they're rubbish.
There was hardly a car parked up in the village yesterday, they couldn't have all gone shopping at once.
Agree, I work in the industry and wish they would stop too! Hundreds of tech and support crew moving around the country (even with remote production) - just a silly risk we don't need for a few months. I appreciate a good portion of crew are self employed, with the associated financial issues that may bring, but are people going to become seriously ill if they don't have "live" televised sport?
They are obviously not that different, which is good news for all of us. Let’s get on jabbing
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
Makes you wonder why the government are so keen to stress this new variant is solely to blame for all of life’s ills mind...
I hope all of those responsible for bringing us all these vaccines are named, credited and properly recognised when this is all over.
it already has
the Johnson-Dido society is already planning what colour carpets to have for it's annual meal.
the Johnson-Dido society is already planning what colour carpets to have for it's annual meal.
I'm sure they are being properly remunerated. Where there is money, their are medicines.
No doubt the Tories will claim credit and give knighthoods and gongs to the old Etonians who did none of the actual work as per normal.
It will never be over. The government doesn’t want it to end and the sheeple don’t want it to end. All obsessed with this “stay safe” BS.
Johnson has recently been been blaming the new variant for the crisis. Variants appear where Covid has not been controlled in the community. South Africa, Brazil and England. Not much chance of an Australian or New Zealand variant.
You know this, do you? You're an expert on how genes mutate, eh? Or just a remoaner talking drivel.
Lest we forget there will be a US variant soon, too. The UK and US don't need to look to the government as the key factor we're not controlling the virus, but self-importance and lack of common sense from many of our people.
fair comment. There's more chance of a spontaneous mutation happening in a country with a million cases as opposed to a country with none. The fact - so far- no US super strain has been discovered probably has more to do with poor US sequencing of strains than anything else.
Developing countries like Brazil and the U.K. have corrupt governments that are not prepared to sacrifice business interests to save lives.
Viruses mutate at random in the body. A new strain could appear anywhere.
True. The higher the number of infections transmitted the greater the risk of mutations occurring during transmission. Mutations happen when errors occur in transcription of the viral DNA code during the viral replication process. Mutations that confer no advantage die out. Mutations that confer an advantage are more likely to survive and become the dominant type. Survival of the fittest
Viruses mutate for a number of reasons, one being previous exposure to similar viruses, or disease, another an existing weak immune system. Clearly the numbers of infected does have an impact in terms of the chance of mutation, but a single infection on a desert island could generate a variant, depending on the circumstances.
By that logic there should be 3 or 4 US variants by now
“Appears to work” the government appears to be doing a great job and Brexit appears to be a good idea..
Because it is more infectious maybe?
It is the variants that have yet to emerge that we need to prevent entering the UK.
It's an odd editorial decision that we can call strains of a virus British but not the origin of the virus as Chinese
We should, perhaps, at least be calling the original strain the "Chinese strain".
It's nothing to do with the Chinese holding the WHO (amongst others) over the barrel of a gun, honest
CNN seem to now be at odds to call it a strain that was originally identified by the UK as opposed to the UK variant. Good journalistic lead I would say? The back story from China about its origins stinks however. Sounding more like a Trump election fraud story
Could always call it "Trump's Chinese virus". Honestly it doesn't matter where it originally started, a virus is a virus and needs to be dealt with.
No, you can't call something 'the Chinese virus' all the time, that's dumb. You have to give it a proper name like sars-cov-2.
Don't get me wrong, I dislike China very much but let's be sensible about this particular issue.
Don't get me wrong, I dislike China very much but let's be sensible about this particular issue.
It only started being called Chinese by Trump when he needed a scapegoat to avoid blame for his own actions (or lack of them).
Despite that glaring contradiction and China's bureaucratic games with the WHO inspection team; there's a palpable and curious sense from world leaders that they all want to gloss over China's clear role at the very roots of all this and think about something closer to home.
Absolutely right, we should the ‘British’ strain by its correct name:
The ANDROMEDA strain!
The ANDROMEDA strain!
Nobody is arguing the origins of covid, or it's variants, however calling covid just "the China virus" is pejorative. And just for the sake of accuracy (and perhaps a smidgeon of pedantry), the origin of covid isn't "Chinese" (it doesn't have a nationality) - it's China (as far as we know).
That is not right. Why should it be called the British variant when it is clearly the English variant as it originated in Kent.
A predictable BBC editorial decision. Woke defines what may be said at Auntie it seems.
Yes let’s try and blame someone. Tory Trumpy tactics
The original virus is called SARS-CoV-2 or covid19. The variant in question is called SARS-CoV-2 VOC 202012/01. They have these names, given by WHO, and the BBC should use them.
https://www.oxfordstudent.com/2020/07/08/coronavirus-found-before-china-outbreak/
It's been found elsewhere before it was found in China.
It's been found elsewhere before it was found in China.
It's also interesting (and perhaps more than a coincidence) that the 'British strain' started in Kent and London and not, say, Manchester or Leeds. What are London and Kent closer to?
It's also pretty naive of people to think it really did originate in the UK, as opposed to the UK just being the first to detect it.
I think the editorial decision comes down to the fact that we all know what Covid-19 is, we don't need to refer to it by its place of origin. But with different variants popping up then the quickest and easiest way to identify them in the media is by place of origin. It's easier for readers to understand 'UK variant' or 'UK strain' rather than VUI-202012/01.
Odd but entirely predictable.
It's called propaganda my old mate.
Yes but we still talk about Spanish Flu when in fact it originated in America.
In fact had absolutely nothing to do with Spain.
In fact had absolutely nothing to do with Spain.
It’s been commonly referred to as the Wuhan coronavirus. The reason China virus isn’t used is because the far-right in the US hijacked that term.
The BBC hate the British?
Still.no guarantee the virus stated in China
Yes it was identified there
Yes the Chinese have not been fully cooperative with other nations
Now has uk been working fully with other nations- no
Has uk got one the highest infection and death rates - yes
Easy to blame others think glass houses and bricks etc
Yes it was identified there
Yes the Chinese have not been fully cooperative with other nations
Now has uk been working fully with other nations- no
Has uk got one the highest infection and death rates - yes
Easy to blame others think glass houses and bricks etc
Prove this started in China.
Seriously, what do you know that others don’t or are not saying?
FWIW unicorns don’t exist, yet they do.
I will leave you to use your cognitive skills and abilities to figure it out.
Seriously, what do you know that others don’t or are not saying?
FWIW unicorns don’t exist, yet they do.
I will leave you to use your cognitive skills and abilities to figure it out.
It's call a British strain because it mutated in Britain. That's standard scientific terminology.
The information being given to media has more variants than the virus or vaccines being used to combat this particular flu.
When a vaccine resistant strain develops, people are going to need to remain calm. We can't just keep locking down, and will have to learn to live with this virus. As a country we have already collectively lost some 70 million "years" of life.
You mean learn to die with the virus. It's mutating very fast sooner or later the vaccine will be no good and the whole thing will have start again. By then quite possibly the virus will have mutated enough to be deadly to all ages. Lets pull the drawbridges up before it's too late. New Zealand had the right idea.
The only ones to lose years of life, are the ones that have died, having to do as you're told to save lives, should not be seen as hardship, I thought humans are the caring species
When a vaccine resistant strain develops,
encouraged by govt extending the interval between vaccinations without a shred of evidence.
encouraged by govt extending the interval between vaccinations without a shred of evidence.
You haven’t lost any years of your life you have just lived a year differently. Stop being a drama Queen.
Better get used to it because there's probably worse to come, the melting of the permafrost doesn't just give us frozen wooly mammoths and sabre toothed tigers, it also releases pathogens that pre-date humans and for which we know nothing about and will likely have no defence against
These people who have made the vaccinations possible are just amazing
"researchers looked at blood samples taken from eight people"
8 people is hardly a conclusive study
8 people is hardly a conclusive study
That's why they're not concluding it's major breakthrough - merely that it looks promising and I find that worth knowing.
But maybe you'd rather they kept it secret until they've definitely absolutely proven without a shadow of doubt that it cures everybody who just looks at it?
But maybe you'd rather they kept it secret until they've definitely absolutely proven without a shadow of doubt that it cures everybody who just looks at it?
Okay, place your bets. How many days until we hear about a NEW, new variant that may or may not work against this vaccine, meaning therefore we must abandon all hope and lockdown some more?
Pardon my pessimism, but for every bit of good news, there always seems to be a bit of bad news later to cancel it out. It's almost as if they're doing this deliberately to torment us.
Pardon my pessimism, but for every bit of good news, there always seems to be a bit of bad news later to cancel it out. It's almost as if they're doing this deliberately to torment us.
I’m not in any way religious - but, Praise The Lord!! Wonderful news.
That along with the UK government and all of those involved are making fantastic progress with the rollout - thank you to all involved in the vaccination program
That along with the UK government and all of those involved are making fantastic progress with the rollout - thank you to all involved in the vaccination program
Don't praise the Lord. Praise the scientists.
"Experts think the UK strain, which emerged in September, may be up to 70% more transmissible."
Prediction - Govt will try to ease restrictions over Spring, cases will spike in Summer, and come 2022 we'll still be in lockdown with kids still off school, mounting national debt & more unemployed people than ever.
Prediction - Govt will try to ease restrictions over Spring, cases will spike in Summer, and come 2022 we'll still be in lockdown with kids still off school, mounting national debt & more unemployed people than ever.
Cases will surely go down in summer like they did last year. Everyone's immune systems are stronger, people are outside more, etc. We need to open up much more in summer this year.
There has been a great deal of silence about new variants from Astrazeneca. Both Pfgizer and Moderna have said they can tweak their vaccines - nothing from AZ. Given that AZ's efficacy is also lower than the other two have we been sold a pup just because it is UK developed and cheaper?
Hear hear !
"Or just a remoaner talking drivel."
We know you lot won, you don't have to keep reminding us, whether it is relevant to the HYS you are in or not...
We know you lot won, you don't have to keep reminding us, whether it is relevant to the HYS you are in or not...
a) Its got nothing to do with Brexit b) Its obvious to anyone with a modicum of intellegence that the more prevalent the virus the more the chance of a mutation. c) your monomania about Brexit makes you blind to any rational thought.
There's always some mouth-breather who has to make it about Brexit, isn't there?
It's actually very basic. An individual virus has a probability of mutating. The more virus subject to that probability, the more mutations. The more mutations, the greater the risk of a problematic one and not just ones that are unviable and die out. So he's spot on.
Wow that is a DUMB comment.
Simple facts seem to be a bit much for you (I wonder why)
Let's explain in nice short words.
If you don't get the virus, it can't mutate in you.
If there are no cases in your country, there is nowhere for it to mutate.
If there are lots of cases in your country, there are lots of people who it can mutate in.
Simple enough for you?
Simple facts seem to be a bit much for you (I wonder why)
Let's explain in nice short words.
If you don't get the virus, it can't mutate in you.
If there are no cases in your country, there is nowhere for it to mutate.
If there are lots of cases in your country, there are lots of people who it can mutate in.
Simple enough for you?
What has Brexit or Remaining got to do with viral mutation? Fraser is correct, the more the virus spreads, the more it has a chance to mutate. That's not virology or genetics, that's basic maths. How much it mutates specifically then depends on many other factors. A simple web search would tell you that.
It's all about numbers: the more people infected, the greater number of viral particles produced. A low probability of mutation simply means more chances of producing a variant.. I am a genetics graduate, so I do know "how genes mutate", but you only needs maths
Congrats on being duped into giving up your freedoms and rights by the super-rich. You must feel proud.
Some people are , but you are clearly not he was talking about the virus and you in your typical Brexiter ignorance go on about genes. Completely different.
Us Remoaners are calling the Kent Strain the Brexit Strain. ??????
Us Remoaners are calling the Kent Strain the Brexit Strain. ??????
That was just an intelligent observation, no need to be an expert to see that possible link.
He obviously has more knowledge that you do. Mutations happen when errors occur during replication of the viral DNA code. Mutations that confer an advantage survive. Mutations that confer no advantage die out. The higher the number of infections, the higher the transmission rate and the greater the risk of mutations occurring. The more infections the greater the risk of new variants appearing.
How is Brexit relevant here ?
Several words in this article means that this has yet to be proven out as factual information. How about actually proving it works against the new variants before writing up such a thing.
Last year we were in the middle of a situation where Covid-19 disinformation was rife. We need as much accurate and up to date information from the media as possible to fight this thing correctly in 2021.
Last year we were in the middle of a situation where Covid-19 disinformation was rife. We need as much accurate and up to date information from the media as possible to fight this thing correctly in 2021.
If you read the details, you'll see the actual facts being reported, namely that blood samples taken from people vaccinated with the Moderna vaccine suggest antibodies triggered by the vaccine can recognise & fight the new variants.
That's all the information available so far, but nevertheless, it's excellent news & well worth reporting. We won't know for some time how well it works in practice.
That's all the information available so far, but nevertheless, it's excellent news & well worth reporting. We won't know for some time how well it works in practice.
All analysis is down to probabilities, since we can't have infinite data. Even if no one in a vaccinated group got Covid, and everyone in the unvaccinated group did, we are still only talking about probabilities and not certainty. It's just a question of what probability causes you to accept a result.
Maybe if our borders were shut, or at least testing people on entry, we wouldn't have to deal with any new variants ??
Whilst I agree on quarantining new arrivals to the country, and discouraging all travel generally, you are mistaken if you think only foreigners are responsible for new variants.
The virus will mutate wherever it is, and is more likely to come up with a successful mutation (i.e. one that replicates) in places where there are lots of infections. Like the UK for example.
The virus will mutate wherever it is, and is more likely to come up with a successful mutation (i.e. one that replicates) in places where there are lots of infections. Like the UK for example.
This is the one we won't get until March, right? Let's hope the others are similarly effective,
It's an odd editorial decision that we can call strains of a virus British but not the origin of the virus as Chinese
Yes - that’s one thing that Trump did get right yet he was vilified for saying it !
Well... its definitely all Chinese to me.
For ours, take your pick from UK variant, Garden of England strain, or Plague Island game changer.
Perhaps also UK Mad cow?
Seeing as the vaccine does NOT reduce your chances of catching COVID, it does NOT stop you spreading it & you would still have to follow all social distancing guidelines, can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine, when the overall IFR for people under 40 is 0.1%?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
Before anyone asks, the 0.1% is based from this article by Imperial College:
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/207273/covid-19-deaths-infection-fatality-ratio-about/
It is from October so if there has been an update on this please let me know and provide a link
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/207273/covid-19-deaths-infection-fatality-ratio-about/
It is from October so if there has been an update on this please let me know and provide a link
It can't hurt you taking it, and can reduce the risk of getting long Covid.
Because it does reduce your chance of catching covid after the first 3 weeks, and it does reduce your chance of spreading it, after the first 3 weeks - and it's not just the IFR it's the high chance of long term symptoms and the chance of accidentally passing it on to someone who is in that .1%?
It is not yet known if the vaccine stops or greatly reduces the ability to spread covid.
Yes, I'm waiting for some half decent journalist to ask the same questions - can't quite work out why no one does?
They do seem pretty obvious questions that would be asked.
They do seem pretty obvious questions that would be asked.
Moderate reason- there are people who cannot have the vaccine, the more we can suppress the virus in the population by reducing carried viral load will help protect them.
If fewer people are then hospitalised/don’t get long covid better overall for treatment of those that are.
I agree not a “great” reason but also not a bad one either - helping society in non specific way.
If fewer people are then hospitalised/don’t get long covid better overall for treatment of those that are.
I agree not a “great” reason but also not a bad one either - helping society in non specific way.
Well if you were the 0.01% waiting to die in a hospital bed, no family around you, gasping for your last breath, I think you would wish you'd had the vaccine - no argument, just common sense!
I'm not an expert but logic tells me due to the rapid mutations of Covid so far that sooner or later it will change so much that the vaccines will not be able keep up with it. Plus it could mutate enough to be deadly to all ages. It is changing very fast now. Bit of a doomsday scenario I know. We are in the situation now because Westminster did not react fast enough in the first place.
It will reduce the severity of the infection,it will help against the possibility of a mutation,it will help you to not develop long Covid.
There are approximately 17 million people aged between 20 and 40 in the UK. An IFR of 0.1% would suggest up to 170,000 deaths in that age group. No idea if that counts as a good reason for you.
"can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine"
To reduce the possibility of serious effects from the virus. Long Covid even among the younger generations will lead to a large health burden. The cost of vaccinating them is trivial compared to the costs of not doing so.
To reduce the possibility of serious effects from the virus. Long Covid even among the younger generations will lead to a large health burden. The cost of vaccinating them is trivial compared to the costs of not doing so.
Here's the simple answer - it stops you getting sick. My mate who is the same age as me (35), also fit as a fiddle, was almost hospitalised with covid. He couldn't stand for even one minute before feeling extremely short of breath. Had he been vaccinated he wouldn't have gotten sick.
There is no room for debate on anything, let alone ppl making informed decisions not to take a vaccine, which by all accounts would still be in the trial phase, but due to demands of covid on our population, everyone is expected to follow the rule & get injected with virus, using mRNA, wow, hang on a minute, surely these trials should be given time to be appropriately assessed & ALL data published
Will those that put out the scare stories, please check facts first, there are some people who are very worried...
You forget that many of those putting out scare stories know this and take advantage of it. Whether to hamper efforts of a rival country to address Covid, or to simply divide the country politically so it wastes time arguing internally, or to make money from gullible people.
first rule of the media
never let the truth get in the way of a good story/publicity
never let the truth get in the way of a good story/publicity
Generally the media. Majority of them who are educated are in the arts and humanities. When it comes to science stories most of them are floundering. Given they then have to dumb their reporting down for your average Brit it's no surprise much of it comes across as scaremongering and full of minor, but important, errors.
Don't praise the government, praise the MHRA and NHS who have been effective in their response. The government has repeatedly proved itself incompetent, but the independent MHRA and NHS where not hampered by government incompetence have been excellent.
The scientists are guided by the lord my son.
Maybe God has helped the scientists? There are scientists out there who have faith!
The race continues, Safe, effective vaccine rollout v continued government stupidity, they're running neck and neck at the moment
It's all a scam
Removed
We may be one of the worst countries at responding to the virus by way of modifying behaviour (lockdowns, mask wearing, school closures etc) but we're certainly at the forefront of scientific research around identifying strains and treatments for COVID.
mmmmmmmmmm?..........or we could be the idiots who skip adequete testing.
Wording released by the big pharmas will have had at least a dozen lawyers scruitinizing it first.
I say this because the statement is unspecific and from past occurrences,will always have a sell ASAP intent attatched to it.
I say this because the statement is unspecific and from past occurrences,will always have a sell ASAP intent attatched to it.
By relentless reporting of the doom laden data from Whitty and Vallance plus SAGE along with daily death reports and cases with zero context and also welcoming Professor Lockdown back onto our screens as the go to man for a quote of the nutty professor's predictions of death.
Encamped news crews in Covid wards with a daily dose of morbidity no uplifting stories, no news on recovery rates etc
Encamped news crews in Covid wards with a daily dose of morbidity no uplifting stories, no news on recovery rates etc
The Professor on the Today program outlined the advantages of the longer period before the 2nd injection...could not bring himself to pass an opinion on the BMA ? comment other than to say their research was flawed..no comment on this web site to this good news
It may be something to do with the fact that they didn't give this particular gig to their Eton chums.
The NHS did this not your government. They did this inspite of years of underfunding and privatisation creep under their governance. They managed this in the face of the xenophobic ideological decisions made by a large percentage of the populous they kill themselves to save. By all means have a clap on your doorstep though.
8 down votes. They don't like good news.
There's a fantastic treatment for Covid - inhaled interferon beta developed by British company Synairgen - that has had no support from the UK government. Instead, Boris keeps banging on about vaccines as the only way to beat the virus; meanwhile, thousands of people are dying.
The US government are smarter: they've got Synairgen's drug onto their Activ-2 trials today and will use it soon!
The US government are smarter: they've got Synairgen's drug onto their Activ-2 trials today and will use it soon!
They are carrying out trials on it
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-55639096
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-55639096
WELL DONE MODERNA
And May I point out I bought a large number of shares in Moderna back in June.
Thanks.
And May I point out I bought a large number of shares in Moderna back in June.
Thanks.
That'd be a shame, it would be amusing to see how you could do in the UK Billy-Goat Catching Championships...
Not very well at all, I suspect!
Not very well at all, I suspect!
Seeing as the vaccine does NOT reduce your chances of catching COVID, it does NOT stop you spreading it & you would still have to follow all social distancing guidelines, can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine, when the overall IFR for people under 40 is 0.1%?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
Before anyone asks, the 0.1% is based from this article by Imperial College:
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/207273/covid-19-deaths-infection-fatality-ratio-about/
It is from October so if there has been an update on this please let me know and provide a link
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/207273/covid-19-deaths-infection-fatality-ratio-about/
It is from October so if there has been an update on this please let me know and provide a link
You are confusing with science with politics. Scientists provide evidence, it's politicians that make the decisions.
and now extending the 2nd dose with no specific scientific basis, yet they endorse it ignoring the makers requirements and the advice of the WHO. Heads should roll if they get this wrong.
SAGE advised the government to lock down in September to avoid the resurgence of the virus.
The government chose to ignore SAGE.
SAGE were proven right, the government proven wrong.
It is the government that has made mistake after mistake, not the scientists.
The government chose to ignore SAGE.
SAGE were proven right, the government proven wrong.
It is the government that has made mistake after mistake, not the scientists.
Not sure it is the scientists who have made these decisions. More like non-scientists who think everything is negotiable.
You are confusing Science and Scientists.
Science is a process of establishing truth & understanding through developing hypothesis & testing them until eventually proven or disproven to a high degree of certainty.
Scientists - often the best examples of humans - apply their knowledge & expertise in an academic or professional way but make decisions based on the mix evidence that exists today
Science is a process of establishing truth & understanding through developing hypothesis & testing them until eventually proven or disproven to a high degree of certainty.
Scientists - often the best examples of humans - apply their knowledge & expertise in an academic or professional way but make decisions based on the mix evidence that exists today
I think it is Boris who has made those decisions, he has never listened to the advice of the Scientists he even caught Covid not adhering to the rules, this why we have one of the worst Death rates in the world, Boris owns That!
Sept- schools super spreaders and Unis were safe according to scientists.. so i agree lets not generalise as that Sept decision has killed tens of thousands ... all because school is so important not to be missed for a few months as its part of the Cradle to Uni indoctrination of the young so they accept the hopeless life chances (home ownership and wage slaves) set up for them by elite Neo Libs.
And I suppose you know more than most of the best scientific and medical minds in the country, if not the world? I think not...
I think you will find they are government mistakes. Being too slow to react to advice.
No, they don’t make decisions they provide data for the government to act on, or not. The government decided not to lockdown when scientists said it would be wise to, for example
Scientists advise, they did not make the decisions. Very often the advice was and is ignored. Sometimes with good reason sometimes not. It is not simply a case of handing the keys to the cabinet office over to SAGE.
And of course you being the world expert would have done what differently....do say please
That’s not scientists that’s Hancock.
So 9% of the population already vaccinated and 6% have had the virus which leaves us with 15% of the population which are protected. Can we start relaxing the lockdown please.
It may well be far more than 6% who have had the virus. However, the level of protection gained from having the virus is unknown and some have had it more than once.
No not yet.
Maybe if our borders were shut, or at least testing people on entry, we wouldn't have to deal with any new variants ??
Whilst I agree on quarantining new arrivals to the country, and discouraging all travel generally, you are mistaken if you think only foreigners are responsible for new variants.
The virus will mutate wherever it is, and is more likely to come up with a successful mutation (i.e. one that replicates) in places where there are lots of infections. Like the UK for example.
The virus will mutate wherever it is, and is more likely to come up with a successful mutation (i.e. one that replicates) in places where there are lots of infections. Like the UK for example.
Not only that but add in our excellent NHS keeping people alive with it for weeks because their immune system can't find the right key for the lock gives it chance to run riot, the poor souls suffering the worse can become a home for new strains and a slip in infection control can let it out easily.
Still had enough of experts Govey?
It's an odd editorial decision that we can call strains of a virus British but not the origin of the virus as Chinese
There is something missing in this report, that has been reported on other sites like New York Times/FT: a.) the vaccine works against new variants but appears to be less effective. And, therefore, b.) Moderna is working on a booster that could be applied in future if necessary - a part that's missing in this article.
hey...... don't tell people what they are missing
otherwise they may never know.
otherwise they may never know.
In the press release, Moderna noted that:
“a six-fold reduction in neutralizing titers was observed with (the variant discovered in South Africa) relative to prior variants.”
You thought that might have got a mention in the main article?
“a six-fold reduction in neutralizing titers was observed with (the variant discovered in South Africa) relative to prior variants.”
You thought that might have got a mention in the main article?
Sadly - Business is Business ... despite the Pandemic. Note that the report comes from Moderna's own 'In-House' labs. NOT from true independent labs.
Not a surprise - the scaremongering that’s going on is undermined if the scientists can overcome the problems raised by new variants.
It's the BBC. Half the story.
That's the BBC for you... They dumb things down to such a level they are wrong.
Sorry Peter, but you obviously didn't read the article properly - it clearly says that Moderna are testing whether a third dose will boost immunity to the new strains.
I’m sure all of the approved vaccine manufacturers are working on future booster doses to cover emerging new variants. It what we expect them to do.
What is missing on this report is that the vaccine is 'gene technology therapy'. Very remiss to leave this point out as the 'vaccines' are patented under this name and cannot be called vaccines as they do not work like vaccines.
Seeing as the vaccine does NOT reduce your chances of catching COVID, it does NOT stop you spreading it & you would still have to follow all social distancing guidelines, can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine, when the overall IFR for people under 40 is 0.1%?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
You haven't really reported this with enough nuance. The results showed that the vaccine likely works against both the U.K. variant and the South African one but that levels of neutralising antibodies are undiminished against the U.K. variant but relatively more diminished (but not to the extent that they'd fail to protect monkeys) against the South African one.
So 9% of the population already vaccinated and 6% have had the virus which leaves us with 15% of the population which are protected. Can we start relaxing the lockdown please.
Tests based on someone who has had both doses and developed antibodies- how does that compare with one dose and waiting 12 weeks for second, will that be a large enough window for the virus to mutate against virus?
Maybe not in a handful of instances but maybe in a million or two a possibility?
Are we giving virus too much leeway to adapt?
Maybe not in a handful of instances but maybe in a million or two a possibility?
Are we giving virus too much leeway to adapt?
Many congratulations to scientists and those who are participating in the vaccine roll out. Also those who have looked after the sick and vulnerable. Unfortunately has taken the Covid and Brexit government fiascos to expose the Tory party for what it is. Profit before people et al.
You forget it was this Tory govt who funded Oxford/AstraZeneca. And it was this Tory Govt who secured huge supplies of the first vaccines. Naughty Tory govt.
hooray! with a bit of luck rather than skill we are able to save humanity
What was the plan if they didn't or if the others don't. There's an awful lot of eggs in this basket and no plan B.
The plan B would have to be to update these vaccines. For mRNA vaccines like Moderna's and Pfizer's that's easy to do in the lab but the production lag caused would have quite a significant impact on the timescale for ending the pandemic.
Last year when the Gov. placed the orders for various vaccines, they did in fact have a plan B. They ordered at least half a dozen different types so that if the first ones didn't work, there were others in the pipeline.
Obviously, if they all failed, then we would be stuffed, but there's not a lot that could be done about that that I can think of. Maybe you've got some ideas?
Obviously, if they all failed, then we would be stuffed, but there's not a lot that could be done about that that I can think of. Maybe you've got some ideas?
Even with 50% efficacy (flu vaccine) you are effectively protected. Your body will recognise and react to the virus. Trials with first dose of the vaccines had no recorded infections resulting in hospitalisation or death. Yes the vaccines will probs work. Yes there is a risk of you catching CV19 no matter what. People will still be at risk of risk ill health; death is a fact of life
The average age of covid deaths is 82, this is higher than the average life expectancy (81). We need to vaccinate the old and vulnerable, and get back to living.
So, in your medical opinion "death is a fact of life" and "vaccines will probs work"? Shall we rid of pedestrian crossings, guard-rails, life-jackets, doctors, nurses, and all medicines then? Blase indifference puts other people at risk of a totally unnecessary death, on their own, no family near, or just maybe not being able to climb a flight of stairs ever again. Take COVID seriously, people!
as soon as your comment is peer reviewd, I'll add it to wiki
Well I never!
There's a fantastic treatment for Covid - inhaled interferon beta developed by British company Synairgen - that has had no support from the UK government. Instead, Boris keeps banging on about vaccines as the only way to beat the virus; meanwhile, thousands of people are dying.
The US government are smarter: they've got Synairgen's drug onto their Activ-2 trials today and will use it soon!
The US government are smarter: they've got Synairgen's drug onto their Activ-2 trials today and will use it soon!
Still had enough of experts Govey?
Seeing as the vaccine does NOT reduce your chances of catching COVID, it does NOT stop you spreading it & you would still have to follow all social distancing guidelines, can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine, when the overall IFR for people under 40 is 0.1%?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
What the BBC neglect to mention here (unbelievably) is that Moderna themselves have said that their vaccination shows a 'six-fold' reduction in effectiveness against the South African strain. They just think it will still provide some benefit against it still. People meeting even in national lockdown will be responsible for vaccines being undermined by a new mutation and longer restrictions.
Sky News like to make everything sound scarier than it is - coincidentally, Sky also benefit hugely from everyone being locked down at home watching TV all day.
Bang on Alex,you just saved me from thinking the whole country was being sucked into a massive pedantic vortex.
Meanwhile in the EU, they once again did not order enough of this new Moderna vaccine, vaccinations have stalled and the EMA has STILL no approved the AZ vaccine.
Going well then.
Going well then.
meanwhile the UK's exports to the EU are dropping by at least 30% and GDP will take a big tumble. Brexit going well then.
Shortages are down to suppliers not being able to deliver to the contracts they signed. Which is affecting everyone, not just the EU.
UK MHRA has been very effective and deserves a lot of credit for that.
Just to note though...
MHRA was set up in 2003 under the previous government, and is run by a person who joined at the time it was set up. The actions of the MHRA are entirely disconnected from the incompetence and nepotism of this government.
Which probably explains why it has been effective.
Just to note though...
MHRA was set up in 2003 under the previous government, and is run by a person who joined at the time it was set up. The actions of the MHRA are entirely disconnected from the incompetence and nepotism of this government.
Which probably explains why it has been effective.
Seeing as the vaccine does NOT reduce your chances of catching COVID, it does NOT stop you spreading it & you would still have to follow all social distancing guidelines, can anyone tell me why anyone under the age of 40 would want to take the vaccine, when the overall IFR for people under 40 is 0.1%?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
I'm not anti vaxx or looking for an argument, just seeing if anyone can give a good reason why?
You mean like a government that has delivered over 6 million vaccines in a short space of time? That kind of government?